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#1. Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update - from Joe Dyer
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 12:45:07 -0700 From: "Joe Dyer" <joedyer@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update Suzy, I have a suggestion for future group buys. Please don't exclude them in the future. How about determine interest by posting an idea of a product and if enough seem interested, then put out a "spec" for bid by various suppliers. Have a small group, maybe three listmembers, evaluate the bids and then select one and only one supplier. Only then should the deal be publicized to the List! Joe Dyer 95 M3 Dinan3
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#2. Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? - from Joe Dyer
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 12:49:59 -0700 From: "Joe Dyer" <joedyer@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? Jim, I admire your calm understatement of the problem. Only guys with a few pounds low in each tire should not understand the problem now! Joe (DINAN "ho") Dyer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Powell" <jsp98m3@home.com> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmwmpower.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 11:37 AM Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 11:27:59 -0700 > From: Jim Powell <jsp98m3@home.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > Public letter to idiots: > > What do you guys do to be able to afford ANY car? This is basic business. > Think about what you are doing. Think about WHY IN THE HELL THESE GUYS MAKE > THESE DEALS. If someone usually sells something for $400 and they agree to > sell them for a 25% discount, maybe, just maybe, they need to sell VOLUME to > make it worth their trouble. > > And then when the first vendor finds out that there is another deal from the > E36M3 group with their competition they don't exactly have nice thoughts > about the person who set the deal up with them. Try this crap with your > present employer. I bet you can get a more in depth explanation from them. > Right before they boot your sorry ass. > > Instead of asking stupid ass questions like this, go slap the crap out of > every teacher you ever had. They apparently did you a disservice. Jeeze. > > Jim > > Suzy Kraft wrote: > > > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 13:15:48 -0500 > > From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > > It pisses the vendors off when they try to give us a great price on > > something in the hopes of selling more of them, and then another vendor > > comes along and offers the same price to take some of the sales away. > > It makes the vendors not even want to bother. > > > > Suzy > > > > Chris Casey wrote: > > > > > > Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 11:04:36 -0700 (PDT) > > > From: Chris Casey <ccasey1@yahoo.com> > > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > > > > Could you explain this? I've read and reread the post > > > and don't get why his additional offer would cause a > > > problem. > > > > > > Not upset, just wondering... > > > > > > << This is exactly why we won't have anymore group > > > purchases on this list. I don't have much time > > > today, my sister is visiting from Germany and > > > this is her last day here. But this really pisses > > > me off. >> > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Chris > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. > > > http://invites.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > List Commands > > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > > > ************************************************************* > > > > ************************************************************* > > List Commands > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > > ************************************************************* > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > ************************************************************* > >
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#3. Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update - from Jim Powell
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Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:49:24 -0700 From: Jim Powell <jsp98m3@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update It basically goes like this: Sean Hester Incorporated wants to sell pork rinds to the E36M3 group because that group has a cumulative girth index of 1.27 times the national average. So SHI makes a deal with 'a purchasing agent' for the E36M3 group. SHI sits back and hopes for the best so they can clear out their old inventory and get ready for b'ness with the E46M3 group who is hot for Cajun Rinds. Well lets see what happens. Some 'other' purchasing agent has a buddy at Interloper Incorporated who sells rinds too. And he makes a deal, no strings attached. Does SHI feel threatened? Do the say WTF??? Do they think the first purchasing agent isn't too smart or ethical? Is it possible that SHI will lose a few sales to Interloper Inc? It will sometimes happen that a discussion takes place about a product and a deal gets put together. When that happens, bask in the glow and take advantage of it if you need the product. If the vendor/group buy runs its course and ends, feel free to set one up with your best buddy down at Pep Boys. But your initial reaction to a group buy shouldn't be to copy it and threaten the relationships built in the first one. If you do, YOU ARE A GOOBER. Jim Sean Hester wrote: > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:18:57 PDT > From: "Sean Hester" <seanh_race@hotmail.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > well... i didn't really get it either... the explanations helped a bit > though. > > i guess i've been hit in the head too many times, being a racer and an > instructor. ;-( > > >From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >Reply-To: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmwmpower.com> > >Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > >Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 14:07:37 -0500 > > > >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 13:58:06 -0500 > >From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > > >I can't believe that some people just don't get it. > > > >Suzy > > > >Ken Robb wrote: > > > > > > I must be missing something. What pisses you off? > > > > > > Suzy Kraft wrote: > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:06:19 -0500 > > > > From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > > > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > > > > > > > This is exactly why we won't have anymore group purchases on this > >list. > > > > I don't have much time today, my sister is visiting from Germany and > > > > this is her last day here. But this really pisses me off. > > > > > > > > Suzy > > > > > > > > Mdriver13@aol.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 12:45:14 EDT > > > > > From: Mdriver13@aol.com > > > > > Subject: Sway Group Purchase Update > > > > > > > > > > Today's follow-up on sway bar GP: > > > > > > > > > > If Top-Notch sells out of all ten, you can call Auto Additions in > >Allentown, > > > > > PA. They will give you the same deal at $300 for the Eibach sways > >and they > > > > > have 6-7 sets in stock. Call Phil at 1-800-334-6074 or > >610-391-1126, tell > > > > > them you are one of the E36M3 group members. They would like a > >minimum of > > > > > three orders for this price. Please let me know if you purchase > >from Auto > > > > > Addictions. > > > > > > > > > > Have fun!!!!! Love the power of Group buying ;-)) Thanks, Suzy > >and to all. > > > > > I think between Suzy and I searching high and low, we have > >uncovered all of > > > > > the currently available Eibach sways in this Country. Well, > >probably most > > > > > anyway <g>. > > > > > > > > > > Post note: This is the first time I have helped put together a GP. > >I have > > > > > probably done some things wrong, but trust me my heart's in the > >right place. > > > > > I may not even take part in this, since I'm working with a lister to > >buy his > > > > > "still in the box" sways. > > > > > > > > > > Bob Gill > > > > > 97 ///M3 coupe > > > > > Philly Region SCCA > > > > > 1st AS - '97 > > > > > 2nd AS - '98 & '99 > > > > > mov'in to ESP in '01 > > > > > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > List Commands > > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing > >list. > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > List Commands > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing > >list. > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > -- > > > ----------------------------------------------------- > > > Click here for Free Video!! > > > http://www.gohip.com/freevideo/ > > > > > >************************************************************* > >List Commands > >UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > >************************************************************* > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > *************************************************************
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#4. Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? - from Jim Powell
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Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:50:58 -0700 From: Jim Powell <jsp98m3@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? I've always tried to be subtle and use a gentle touch to correct. :) Jim Joe Dyer wrote: > Jim, > > I admire your calm understatement of the problem. Only guys with a few > pounds low in each tire should not understand the problem now! > > Joe (DINAN "ho") Dyer > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Powell" <jsp98m3@home.com> > To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmwmpower.com> > Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 11:37 AM > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 11:27:59 -0700 > > From: Jim Powell <jsp98m3@home.com> > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > > Public letter to idiots: > > > > What do you guys do to be able to afford ANY car? This is basic business. > > Think about what you are doing. Think about WHY IN THE HELL THESE GUYS > MAKE > > THESE DEALS. If someone usually sells something for $400 and they agree > to > > sell them for a 25% discount, maybe, just maybe, they need to sell VOLUME > to > > make it worth their trouble. > > > > And then when the first vendor finds out that there is another deal from > the > > E36M3 group with their competition they don't exactly have nice thoughts > > about the person who set the deal up with them. Try this crap with your > > present employer. I bet you can get a more in depth explanation from > them. > > Right before they boot your sorry ass. > > > > Instead of asking stupid ass questions like this, go slap the crap out of > > every teacher you ever had. They apparently did you a disservice. Jeeze. > > > > Jim > > > > Suzy Kraft wrote: > > > > > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 13:15:48 -0500 > > > From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > > > > It pisses the vendors off when they try to give us a great price on > > > something in the hopes of selling more of them, and then another vendor > > > comes along and offers the same price to take some of the sales away. > > > It makes the vendors not even want to bother. > > > > > > Suzy > > > > > > Chris Casey wrote: > > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 11:04:36 -0700 (PDT) > > > > From: Chris Casey <ccasey1@yahoo.com> > > > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why? > > > > > > > > Could you explain this? I've read and reread the post > > > > and don't get why his additional offer would cause a > > > > problem. > > > > > > > > Not upset, just wondering... > > > > > > > > << This is exactly why we won't have anymore group > > > > purchases on this list. I don't have much time > > > > today, my sister is visiting from Germany and > > > > this is her last day here. But this really pisses > > > > me off. >> > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Chris > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > > Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. > > > > http://invites.yahoo.com/ > > > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > List Commands > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing > list. > > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > > List Commands > > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > > > ************************************************************* > > > > > > ************************************************************* > > List Commands > > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > > ************************************************************* > > > >
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#5. Jim's gentle touch (WAS:Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why?) - from Chester Wong
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 13:11:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: Jim's gentle touch (WAS:Re: [E36M3] Group Purchase Debacle -- Why?) Yeah...we're all gonna believe that right? I guess you consider a 14 psi turbo a gentle touch huh? LOL! Chester --- Jim Powell <jsp98m3@home.com> wrote: > I've always tried to be subtle and use a gentle touch to correct. :) > > Jim ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/
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#6. Sway Group Purchase Update - from nabli@attglobal.net
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Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 16:28:25 -0400 From: nabli@attglobal.net Subject: Sway Group Purchase Update Ok, let me try to explain what happened in the hopes that we can finally get back to the real purpose of both lists. A GP interest for Eibach sway bars started on this list: http://topica.com/lists/automotive_tuning/ It's purpose (and I quote) is: "A place for organized quantity discount purchases and vendor advertised specials of automotive tuning accessories and parts." In fact if I'm not mistaken Suzy is a member of that list. That list is obviously not a competitor to the E36M3 list since it is really not an M3 discussion list. Somebody got a vendor to agree to a discount price for a certain minimum # of orders. Don't ask me the details because I don't remember but I am on both lists. Another GP started on the E36M3 list through another vendor. However, many of the members on the automotice_tuning list are also members of the E36M3 list so a cross post started. That when the problem started. Get it?? Bottom line: 1. If you want to start a Gp then YOU need to be the go-between for the group and the particular vendor. 2. If others take the initiative to try to get lower prices then they MUST go back to the person handling the GP (i.e., the go-between) and let that person handle the rest. Now can we get back to posting interesting info - pretty please. :-) Cheers, Jim E. Sean Hester wrote: > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:18:57 PDT > From: "Sean Hester" <seanh_race@hotmail.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > well... i didn't really get it either... the explanations helped a bit > though. > > i guess i've been hit in the head too many times, being a racer and an > instructor. ;-( > > >From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >Reply-To: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmwmpower.com> > >Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > >Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 14:07:37 -0500 > > > >Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 13:58:06 -0500 > >From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > >Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > > >I can't believe that some people just don't get it. > > > >Suzy > > > >Ken Robb wrote: > > > > > > I must be missing something. What pisses you off? > > > > > > Suzy Kraft wrote: > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:06:19 -0500 > > > > From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > > > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > > > > > > > This is exactly why we won't have anymore group purchases on this > >list. > > > > I don't have much time today, my sister is visiting from Germany and > > > > this is her last day here. But this really pisses me off. > > > > > > > > Suzy > > > > > > > > Mdriver13@aol.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 12:45:14 EDT > > > > > From: Mdriver13@aol.com > > > > > Subject: Sway Group Purchase Update > > > > > > > > > > Today's follow-up on sway bar GP: > > > > > > > > > > If Top-Notch sells out of all ten, you can call Auto Additions in > >Allentown, > > > > > PA. They will give you the same deal at $300 for the Eibach sways > >and they > > > > > have 6-7 sets in stock. Call Phil at 1-800-334-6074 or > >610-391-1126, tell > > > > > them you are one of the E36M3 group members. They would like a > >minimum of > > > > > three orders for this price. Please let me know if you purchase > >from Auto > > > > > Addictions. > > > > > > > > > > Have fun!!!!! Love the power of Group buying ;-)) Thanks, Suzy > >and to all. > > > > > I think between Suzy and I searching high and low, we have > >uncovered all of > > > > > the currently available Eibach sways in this Country. Well, > >probably most > > > > > anyway <g>. > > > > > > > > > > Post note: This is the first time I have helped put together a GP. > >I have > > > > > probably done some things wrong, but trust me my heart's in the > >right place. > > > > > I may not even take part in this, since I'm working with a lister to > >buy his > > > > > "still in the box" sways. > > > > > > > > > > Bob Gill > > > > > 97 ///M3 coupe > > > > > Philly Region SCCA > > > > > 1st AS - '97 > > > > > 2nd AS - '98 & '99 > > > > > mov'in to ESP in '01
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#7. Re: Group Purchases - from S Lafredo
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 13:22:27 -0700 (PDT) From: S Lafredo <slafredo@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Group Purchases Group, A long time ago I decided that group purchases should not be conducted on information list such as these. If you are intereset in doing group purchases email me and I will add you to my Topica "Automotive Tuning" group purchase list that I set-up for just that purpose. Let keep the gp noise off of here and concetrate on the performance discussions. HTH. <- keep Suzy's bp in check :) Stephen --- Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> wrote: > Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 12:06:19 -0500 > From: Suzy Kraft <suekraft@mindspring.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > This is exactly why we won't have anymore group purchases on this > list. > I don't have much time today, my sister is visiting from Germany and > this is her last day here. But this really pisses me off. > > Suzy __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Kick off your party with Yahoo! Invites. http://invites.yahoo.com/
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#8. Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update - from Seth Thomas
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 16:33:29 -0400 From: "Seth Thomas" <porsche993@mindspring.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update Joe and list, I think some of you are missing the point here. Suzy, the list admin, set up a group deal with a vendor who has been nice to the list and has always made special pricing available to us. They have been loyal to us and we should be the same back to them. We should not have a bidding war with vendors and then use the lowest one. This is not a government mailing list ; ) The problem with group deals is that people set them up, have interested parties involved, these people then decide to go out and find a better deal with other vendors, and then there is not enough interest for the deal to take place or doing this pisses off the first vendor so he refuses to complete the purchase. Now everybody is screwed because a few people think this deal is not good enough. You want my suggestions for group purchases? Here they are: 1. One person puts it together because it is their idea and they want a great deal on the product. 2. He post this information to the list striking up the interest. 3. The list and only the list is able to participate. This means don't pass this on to any message boards, freinds, family or any other vendors. 4. If you want this product at this price, get on the group deal. If not then don't but don't you dare try to get this deal from some other vendor. This hurts the whole list and makes the vendor NOT WANT TO DO ANY GROUP DEALS IN THE FUTURE. 5. If you do anything that harms the group deal then you are off the mailing list. These are just some quick and angry thoughts. Why do I get mad about stuff like this? Because everytime that I or somebody else on the list trys to put something like this together somebody has to F__K IT UP! So from now on if you guys want in, then get in, but don't go and try to get this same price somewhere else as you won't find it. And don't F__K UP anymore group deals this list puts on. Seth Thomas www.m3ltw.com www.m3power.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe Dyer <joedyer@home.com> To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmwmpower.com> Sent: Wednesday, August 02, 2000 3:47 PM Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 12:45:07 -0700 > From: "Joe Dyer" <joedyer@home.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update > > Suzy, > > I have a suggestion for future group buys. Please don't exclude them in the > future. > > How about determine interest by posting an idea of a product and if enough > seem interested, then put out a "spec" for bid by various suppliers. Have a > small group, maybe three listmembers, evaluate the bids and then select one > and only one supplier. Only then should the deal be publicized to the List! > > Joe Dyer > 95 M3 Dinan3 > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > ************************************************************* > >
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#9. Re : M3 for track, auto-x and learning-->can the M3 be brought down a notch? - from daanesh chanduwadia
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Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 20:38:34 GMT From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> Subject: Re : M3 for track, auto-x and learning-->can the M3 be brought down a notch? to add to the (long forgotten) thread about the M3's on the limit behavior, I've been running 225/45R17 Bridgestone Pole Positions for exactly this reason. it originally started as an academic 'the 235/40s are too wide for my stock 7.5s' but I've found the cars handling to be far more satisfying on the street. tire choice has helped (I started by switching to 225/45R17 MXX3s then tried the pole positions b/c they're known for their progressive breakaway.) the tradeoff is slower response in the gears (my stock 3.15 is now effectively a 3.08) and - with the PPs - vague on center steering. another thing to consider in alignment settings -- I had been running factory spec in the rear until recently, but with the most recent alignment reduced the toe and took the camber down to 1.7 degrees negative from (1.9). the rear end is more adjustable without feeling 'loose' (this with the stock 95 suspension and sway bars.) [my next purchase will be suspension (DINAN or Hartge) but I'm toying with the idea of 95 stock with 96+ rear shocks. my logic is the firmer rear shocks will give me more transitional oversteer/better turn-in while leaving the on the limit balance unchanged. any thoughts?] daanesh 95 M3 test mule p.s. thank you to all of those who have responded to my queries in the past, especially to Hunter for his help with headlights (I'm ordering the FFRs.) >>Is it possible to bring the M3 down to a lower level of handling for learning purposes? I'm already using street tires and cannot stress enough how beneficial this has been on auto-practice days. Going from RE71s to Khumos is dramatic. With the RE71s, I'm forced to focus on each corner, each transition, before the car goes out of control. With the Khumos, "just go down to the end and turn" mentality takes over. What else could be done to slow the transitions, for training purposes only, to bring the car into ti/325 territory (no way to lower horsepower obviously, just don't push the pedal so far)? Lower tire pressure? Softer shock settings? Remove sway bars? ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com
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#10. Need help with suspension problem - from Milvid, Ken LT; USN
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 16:24:55 -0500 From: "Milvid, Ken LT; USN" <Milvid@asciet.eglin.af.mil> Subject: Need help with suspension problem I have a 95 with stock suspension and I'm looking for some help before I take it in for service. I am getting a clunking noise over bumps from my front, passenger side similar to the one that occurs due to bad rear bushings. Upon checking it out I found that the self-locking retainer nut on top of the strut tower was loose. I tightened it up but I still have the noise. All other suspension components are tight, loaded and unloaded. It does appear that the strut tower rotates ever so slightly when I lift the car from the wheel well and I don't see this on the drivers side. Should it rotate slightly? Any other suggestions of what to check? Your help is greatly appreciated. LT Ken Milvid ASCIET AEW/C2 SME 104 Biscayne Road Eglin AFB, FL 32542-5310 DSN 872-9046 ext 287 COMM (850) 882-XXXX mailto:milvid@asciet.eglin.af.mil
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#11. Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update - from Mdriver13@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 2000 17:27:22 EDT From: Mdriver13@aol.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] Sway Group Purchase Update To All, Well, Jim E. has the story right. Read his post, no need to explain it again. Seth, if what you say is right, I'm the one who should be pissed, since my Eibach deal was none a day before Suzy's. I get a vendor, then the next day Suzy post another deal with another vendor. Her deal was best in the fact that there was no minimum. Hey, I didn't get pissed, put her GP before mine. Geeezzzz! Now, let's move on. Anyway, this country is built on free enterprise, if one vender doesn't want our business, another will. That's the way My Company works! and we're the largest in our field too. I agree, none of this would have happened with a system in place. Sorry again, but I was working without a road map on this one. Thought I was carrying the ball, until yesterday???? Bob Gill 97 ///M3 coupe Philly Region SCCA 1st AS - '97 2nd AS - '98 & '99 mov'in to ESP in '01