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#1. Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Michael Lawrence
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 14:48:34 -0400 From: "Michael Lawrence" <95m3ltw@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info Ok, I think I can put it as simple as you want this question answered! At what point do you want to stay alive, at what point do you still want to be around for your wife and or kids? At what dollar level do you value your life? I have been in a car that rolled and no roof will tend to support more than 1 roll. Granted, I think driving schools are safer than your daily commute on a freeway. So no-one can answer that question for you. Also, do people ride in your backseat, how often etc?. If you have a roll bar in your car and let folks ride in the back, they most likely will be killed by it in a bad accident. So basically you will be making your car a 2 seat vehicle. I personally put a roll bar in my M3 after the second school I did. But I am also the type that drives at 10/10ths and beyond. Most people thought I had lost my mind when I put the roll bar in, but it gave me a peice of mind and I used 4 pt harnesses for the street too. I tend to drive at high speeds on long trips. 500+ miles at 90-130mph. Very long, very boring, very empty interstates between here and her. Cruise control at 140mph is kind cool actually. If I were doing 3 or less schools a year, I probably would not put a bar in, but if I am doing more than that, yes I put as much safety equipment as I can afford. I would also say that I have never seen a M3 wreck at a drivers school in such a way that a roll bar would have helped. Well except for the summit point wreck. Now, in club racing, I have seen plenty where the cage probably saved the persons life. After what I have seen, I will not track a car at speed without atleast the following roll bar, 4 pt harness, a very good racing seat, neck brace, full face helmet I have had 2 wrecks where I was in a vehicle that stopped from 65mph+ to 0 in a matter of a few feet. I think in both cases, the seat itself helped as much as anything else. Mike
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#2. Are Dinan prices fixxed through all dealers or negotiable? - from Dave Spragg
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:01:08 -0400 From: "Dave Spragg" <dspragg@mediaone.net> Subject: Are Dinan prices fixxed through all dealers or negotiable? Please email privately as I know the list is not largely Dinan fans. :) My car is disabled and I have been in contact with Jim himself and even he can't help me. I am going to price out the Dinan deal. If my line above does not make sense, what I am asking is if I go buy a Dinan Intake, ECU, and stuff from the BMW Gallery (BMW dealer very near me) will it cost the same as all the other Dinan dealers? Thanks Dave Spragg dave@spragg.com Natick, MA 99 M3 Sharked 92 330is Sharked and Supercharged
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#3. Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Andrew E. Kalman
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:10:57 -0700 From: "Andrew E. Kalman" <aek@pumpkininc.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info Peter asks: Re: >I know my wife would be ecstatic to see me drop in a roll bar, but when is >it necessary or when are you simply going to look like a wannabe? How >do you know that you've gotten to a point that a roll bar is something you >really should be driving with? > >I'm really interested in people's thoughts... To be honest, I don't think that roll bars or roll cages or racing seats have a place in street-driven cars. If you're gonna drive hard enough that a rollover or serious crash is a possibility, why not use a car that can be optimized for that situation? As you can see from recent crash pics, airbags are nice, and people have walked away from pancaked M3s, but you'd be a whole lot better off with the safety of a cage. Plus, with a dedicated track car, you don't have to skimp on safety, and should you find yourself in a crash, you're most likely to walk away from it a whole lot happier and/or luckier than if you crash your street car. The race car may even be cheaper to repair. My wife used to worry until I went all-out and dedicated my LWT for the track. Yes, I do drive it very rarely on the street (maybe 2-3 times per year). But now she has few, if any worries when I'm out on the track in the race car. The trouble we face is that E36 M3s are way fun on the track, but they're not cheap, and prepping them with a cage and safety equipment is a $3-$10k proposition, plus the cost of acquiring a track car to begin with. That is daunting. I realize it's easy to forget our mortality while driving a shiny nice M3 on the track at 10/10ths with some guy or gal bearing down on you. I'd suggest not pushing it to that level until you're in the protection of a full race car -- that's all. Regards, -- ______________________________________ Andrew E. Kalman, Ph.D. aek@pumpkininc.com
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#4. RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Seth Thomas
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:21:05 -0400 From: "Seth Thomas" <porsche993@mindspring.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info Peter says: "I know my wife would be ecstatic to see me drop in a roll bar, but when is it necessary or when are you simply going to look like a wannabe? How do you know that you've gotten to a point that a roll bar is something you really should be driving with?" You know it is time to install a rollbar whenever one of your friends tells you he would not drive like you do without at least a bar in his car. :) Isn't that right Mike? No for real it is when you feel that you are getting too fast or when you start to value your life in a car. I have been STUPID and not put the one I have in my LTW yet. Do I need one? Yes in a very bad way. I drive way to fast on the track to not have one. I consider myself very lucky in that I have not had an off track experience yet but I have had a couple of close calls. I will not go back on the track in the LTW without one. Do you need one for your first school? I would say no. At what level of run groups do you add one? When you get comfortable pushing your car at high speeds around any race track is when. There is not like a set path to follow. It is how you feel and how well of a driver you are. And also what you want to do on the track. If you are out there to cruise around then you might not need one. If you are there to drive like a racecar driver in a more controlled manner then you need one. It is all a personal experience level. But I would say it is more or less when you start getting to the B run group. That is when I noticed the speeds picking up tremendously with my car. Seth Thomas www.m3ltw.com
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#5. Re: Are Dinan prices fixxed through all dealers or negotiable? - from S Lafredo
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:14:56 -0700 (PDT) From: S Lafredo <slafredo@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Are Dinan prices fixxed through all dealers or negotiable? Yes, everything is fixed for the reason you mention in the last sentence. They don't want you shopping them around. They also fix the labor rate. When I checked the other week it was at $90. So, having your car done at Dinan or some remote BMW/Dinan dealer should cost the same sans the tax. HTH. S --- Dave Spragg <dspragg@mediaone.net> wrote: > If my line above does not make sense, what I am asking is if I go buy > a Dinan Intake, ECU, and stuff from the BMW Gallery (BMW dealer very > near me) will it cost the same as all the other Dinan dealers? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
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#6. Re: [E36M3] Fast and Furious - from Jay Miller
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:31:14 -0700 From: "Jay Miller" <jjmiller6@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Fast and Furious I does promote street racing. Basically it's the same director as Point Break. And it's premise is Point Break with cars instead of surf boards. I've been workign closely with Universal, and on their advertising, and dig the film. But I only saw a one quick glimpse of an E36.. shame. Jay '95 M3 _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
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#7. Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Michael Lawrence
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:37:50 -0400 From: "Michael Lawrence" <95m3ltw@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info ----- Original Message ----- From: "Seth Thomas" <porsche993@mindspring.com> > You know it is time to install a rollbar whenever one of your friends tells > you he would not drive like you do without at least a bar in his car. :) > Isn't that right Mike True, True or did I just say I Wouldnt ride with you without a roll bar, haha. But I would say it is more or less when you > start getting to the B run group. That is when I noticed the speeds picking > up tremendously with my car. Are you sure? I never noticed your speed picking up. lamo, haha. Mike
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#8. RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Daniel Smith
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 12:40:03 -0700 From: Daniel Smith <dls@daniel.org> Subject: RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info [rollbars...] I put a TC Kline in my car because I wanted to use my Schroth 4 point harnesses safely. That was after my 4th school or so. The thing that woke me up to wanting harnesses was the experience I was having at Laguna Seca. I was at the point of having to brace my knees a lot (door/console) in some turns. That seemed distracting, harnesses seemed like a good idea, and the rollbar followed from that... it's just more confidence inspiring to a) feel planted in my seat, and b) know that the safety aspect is a little more in my favor. Daniel p.s. just did big brakes on all 4 wheels - doesn't make me go faster, but it will help me go slower faster :-) -- Daniel L. Smith - dls@daniel.org - Sonoma County, CA
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#9. RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Chester Wong
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 13:00:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info > p.s. just did big brakes on all 4 wheels - doesn't make me go > faster, but it will help me go slower faster :-) Oh no....here we go again! :) Chester ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
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#10. Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info - from Michael Lawrence
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Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 15:59:18 -0400 From: "Michael Lawrence" <95m3ltw@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] M3 Totalled at Summit 6/22 - info ----- Original Message ----- From: "Seth Thomas" <porsche993@mindspring.com> > I never noticed you passing me either.... I know, I was just happy to be as close as I was considering the differences in the cars euro vs US-spec motor, kumho vs Hoosier tires, and especially the difference in top speed on the back straight. I had you in turn one that last lap except for your draft that sucked me into that slide to the edge of the track too, lmao. Glad we didnt have video going for that, would have to burn it. I coudl see it now, "Ok class, here is a in car video of two instructors totaling their LTWs in turn 1, as you can see, you dont want to enter the turn at 110mph with less than a foot between the two cars and much less with 2 newbies riding with them who had never been to a track before" My passenger was like "this is fooking awesome, man, sliding around like that, almost touching, way cool" Um well it is normally not quite like that. If they only knew how close the limit was that day wooooohoooooo, Mike