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#1. Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race - from Jason Lombard
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 10:17:31 -0700 From: "Jason Lombard" <racebro@santacruzbicycles.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race Forgive me if this question has been answered, but I'm going to play the natural skeptic. Josh is claiming 286hp at the rear wheels. What I want to know is, what else is on the car? The M3 reaches fuel limitations at around 270, and starts to hit intake limitations (stock MAF) at 278 (approx). Obviously this car was not stock w/cams, but I'd like to know exactly what was in it. I've seen top notch tuner cars have difficulty hitting those numbers with any repeatability or reliability-- ones with access to BMW's tuning equipment. It's a pretty massive stretch to imply that just throwing in a set of cams will bolt in 46 hp over stock, yet with no other information supplied as to what is in the car, that's what we're left to assume. I am by no means calling Josh a liar-- I am familiar with the quality of the product that he sells, and they're definetely top notch. I would just like complete disclosure of all of the details, so an informed consumer can make an apples to apples comparison. I welcome comments and rebuttles. Sincerely, Jason Lombard Santa Cruz Bicycles, Inc. 831-459-7560 ext. 30 racebro@santacruzbicycles.com www.santacruzbicycles.com ------ > -------------------- 7 -------------------- > Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 02:34:41 -0600 > From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > >(snip) my M3 is > putting out 286hp at the rear wheels est. ~246hp @ crank. They might also > want to try to figure out how they ended up with an E46 M3 that was > generating a hp peak at 7250rpms??? > > www.eurosporthighperformance.com/cams.html > > > Josh > Eurosport
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#2. Re: How do you fit with helmets? - from Daniel Snyder
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 10:27:33 -0700 From: "Daniel Snyder" <m3ltw@msn.com> Subject: Re: How do you fit with helmets? > Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 10:32:51 -0400 > From: Dan Miley <dmiley@rcn.com> > Subject: RE: How do you fit with helmets? > > > Will Turner is 6'5" and he races E30 and E36 cars. He may be using > race seats. TC Kline has Recaro brackets that lower the seat about > 1" and align it properly with the wheel. Will's race cars have the seat brackets cut out of the car, and new mounts fabricated on the floor pan (with race seats). How do I know? I have the same setup (heck, I have a Turner car, so it should look similar-the paint does). Remember, on a race car, you don't have the sunroof to worry about, but the steel roll cage is a much bigger issue for clearance. You can always add padding, but it is far better to be below it, no matter what. Dan S.
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#3. Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock - from Neil Maller
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Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 12:36:35 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock on 10/8/01 12:08 PM, "Mel Silva" <melsilva@mindspring.com> wrote: > Since the 3.2L S52US has more low end torque than the E46 engine Not according to: http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com/cams.html it doesn't. Nowhere near in fact. Shows what a good job BMW did with the E46 M3 engine. Neil 96 M3
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#4. gas mileage - from Joseph Bachman III
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Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 17:32:46 +0000 From: "Joseph Bachman III" <josephbachman@hotmail.com> Subject: gas mileage I found an interesting spec on the E36M3. There is a inversely proportional relationship between the gas milage I get, and the width of the smile across my face. Cool fall country driving in MD on some of classic twisty roads, yielded a 6.5" wide smile, 9.1 MPG, and the loss of about 3K miles of life from my tires. Have fun all! _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
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#5. Re: E36 cam package - from Josh
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Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 11:46:53 -0600 From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> Subject: Re: E36 cam package Good observation. Before we tested the E36 we raised the rev limits and removed the top speed limiter of the car without changing the tuning so that we could view the cars stock performance all the way to 7200rpm. The only other change that was loaded in addition to the raised rev limits was an adjustment of the catalyst override protection fault tolerances so that we could play around with intake stuff without having to worry about the somewhat rare, but real COP induced limp home mode. Josh Eurosport At 09:26 AM 10/8/2001 -0700, andy radin wrote: >Josh, > >How stock was the "stock" run shown in this dyno comparison? I noticed its >redline extends up to the Sharked redline of 7200. Did it already have the >plain-jane software upgrade? > > > http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com/cams.html > >andy r. >98 m3/2 >
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#6. Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race - from The Abels
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 12:51:12 -0500 From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race I believe the 286 rwhp figure was for an E46M3. ----- Original Message ----- From: Jason Lombard <racebro@santacruzbicycles.com> To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 12:19 PM Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 10:17:31 -0700 > From: "Jason Lombard" <racebro@santacruzbicycles.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > > Forgive me if this question has been answered, but I'm going to play the > natural skeptic. Josh is claiming 286hp at the rear wheels. What I want to > know is, what else is on the car? The M3 reaches fuel limitations at around > 270, and starts to hit intake limitations (stock MAF) at 278 (approx). > Obviously this car was not stock w/cams, but I'd like to know exactly what > was in it. I've seen top notch tuner cars have difficulty hitting those > numbers with any repeatability or reliability-- ones with access to BMW's > tuning equipment. It's a pretty massive stretch to imply that just throwing > in a set of cams will bolt in 46 hp over stock, yet with no other > information supplied as to what is in the car, that's what we're left to > assume. > > I am by no means calling Josh a liar-- I am familiar with the quality of the > product that he sells, and they're definetely top notch. I would just like > complete disclosure of all of the details, so an informed consumer can make > an apples to apples comparison. I welcome comments and rebuttles. > > Sincerely, > > Jason Lombard > Santa Cruz Bicycles, Inc. > 831-459-7560 ext. 30 > racebro@santacruzbicycles.com > > www.santacruzbicycles.com > > ------ > > -------------------- 7 -------------------- > > Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 02:34:41 -0600 > > From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > > > >(snip) my M3 is > > putting out 286hp at the rear wheels est. ~246hp @ crank. They might also > > want to try to figure out how they ended up with an E46 M3 that was > > generating a hp peak at 7250rpms??? > > > > www.eurosporthighperformance.com/cams.html > > > > > > Josh > > Eurosport > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. > GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). > > To issue a command/request to the server: > Send a message with the command you wish executed as the > subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. > ************************************************************* > >
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#7. Now RFG II Gas - from Dorffer, Rich
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 13:52:08 -0400 From: "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> Subject: Now RFG II Gas Mel says > > Apparently the Chemical plant that manufactures MTBE is right here in > southeast Houston (opposite side of downtown from me, 'cause I don't want to > be smellin' that stink all day) Aren't all North American chemical plants located in Houston/Beaumont Texas?!? I hear one is living pretty dangerously swimming anywhere near that area of the Gulf. ;-) Kidding aside, I agree with Mel in that EPA should prove how RFG is beneficial in today's society. Regards, Rich - Cleveland has a few odors of it's own.
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#8. Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race - from Bill P
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 13:57:35 -0400 From: "Bill P" <casanova@yorkhost.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race Well I guess I gotta run my buddies E-46 ///M3 with my E-36 SC ///M3. Then we will know what is faster. I drove the new E-46 and the thing pulls like hell, especially over 6000 RPM. It will be a close race but my butt dyno says I will be seeing his car in my rear view. But overall the E-46 ///M3 is an AWESOME car. -------------------- 3 -------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2001 21:14:55 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > Let me ask you...I dont know if you have any familiarty with supercharged > OBDIIs, but, would you care to venture a guess as to how one would have done > had it been a trio instead of a twosome at your track tests? While we don't have a story about comparing the E46M3 to a supercharged E36 M3, we do have a few comparisons (these were all at speed in 3rd gear): E46M3 vs AA Stage 2 Turbo E36 OBDI M3: Winner - Turbo E36 M3...and the driver wasn't even flooring the pedal) OBDI Turbo E36 M3 vs stock (save for exhaust) OBDII E36 M3: Winner - don't even ask...hahahaha Chester =====
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#9. Re: Josh's Magic Tranny - from Josh
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Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 12:01:43 -0600 From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> Subject: Re: Josh's Magic Tranny I got a pretty good laugh from this myself this morning. I think that it proves to me that I shouldn't stay so late at the shop working into the wee hours of the morning on products and inhaling dust and then foolishly attempting to write emails;-) Anyway what I meant to say was that my car puts out 286hp at the rear wheels which is ~346hp@crank. Thanks for the help ;-) Josh Eurosport At 09:48 AM 10/8/2001 -0500, you wrote: >-------------------- 4 -------------------- >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 09:41:49 -0400 >From: "Paul England" <ettsn@mindspring.com> >Subject: Re: Josh's Magic Tranny > >Hey, Josh? What kind of transmission do you have?!? How can the rest of us >get a driveline that ADDS 40hp on the way to the wheels? :) > >-Paul > > > From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> > > Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > > to figure out what was wrong with the car they tested because my M3 is > > putting out 286hp at the rear wheels est. ~246hp @ crank. They might also
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#10. RE: [E36M3] Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock - from Seth Thomas
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Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 14:09:24 -0400 From: "Seth Thomas" <porsche993@mindspring.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock Once again this is another misconception about the Euro vs. US motor. How many of knew that the Euro 3.0L had the same torque as the US 3.2L? Well it does at 236 ft lbs. The old Euro 3.2L had I beleive 260ft lbs at around 3200 RPMs. So the misconception that the Euro motor lacks bottom-end power is not true. Seth Thomas www.m3ltw.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Neil Maller [mailto:neil.maller@gte.net] > Sent: Monday, October 08, 2001 1:39 PM > To: E36M3 > Subject: [E36M3] Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock > > > Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 12:36:35 -0500 > From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> > Subject: Re: E36 vs E46, modified vs stock > > on 10/8/01 12:08 PM, "Mel Silva" <melsilva@mindspring.com> wrote: > > > Since the 3.2L S52US has more low end torque than the E46 engine > > Not according to: > > http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com/cams.html > > it doesn't. Nowhere near in fact. Shows what a good job BMW did > with the E46 > M3 engine. > > Neil > 96 M3 > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. > GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). > > To issue a command/request to the server: > Send a message with the command you wish executed as the > subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. > ************************************************************* > >
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#11. Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race - from Josh
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Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2001 12:11:15 -0600 From: Josh <eurosprt@xmission.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race Remember that the gearing differences of the E46 M3 (364) to E36 M3 (315/323) aren't that different if you include the increased tire diameter of the E46. BTW I do realize that there are some slight differences in trans gearing, but I don't think that they are enough to even worry about (other than a 6th gear;-)) I really think that it is very possible that the cam kit will take the E36 over the top without a change to the gearing. Then again I could be talking out of my butt because the car that I will be acceleration testing against is an otherwise (other than cam kit that is) stock 4dr 3.2l. Josh Eurosport At 09:48 AM 10/8/2001 -0500, you wrote: >-------------------- 3 -------------------- >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 08:41:07 -0500 >From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> >Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > >My experience exactly. My neighbor has shiny new carbon black E46 M3. My >car only has an intake, and dyno'd at 225 rwhp and 226 ft-lbs. Off the >line, I wasn't killed. But when we did roll-on tests from 40 and 60 mph, he >pancaked me. > >I would like to think that your cam kit would turn my car into an E46 >killer, but I bet I'd need the help of more aggressive gearing too. One >more thing to add to the xmas list. ;) > >Jeff 97 M3/4 (anyone got a 3.46 diff and 6-spd for cheap?)
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#12. Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race - from Steven Tom
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Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2001 11:14:03 -0700 From: Steven Tom <stom@qualcomm.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race Jason, You do realize he has an E46 M3 and not a E36 right. The JimC kit (cam, intake ect) dynoed at ~247rwhp. A stock E46 dynoed at 286rwhp. But interesting observations. Are you saying that 21.5lbs fuel injectors are good for 270 rwhp and the OBDII intake manifold is good for 278. The OBDI flows 50% more air than OBDII. Not that I know these answers just wanted to find out what configuration you were talking about. steve At 12:19 PM 10/8/01 -0500, Jason Lombard wrote: >Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2001 10:17:31 -0700 >From: "Jason Lombard" <racebro@santacruzbicycles.com> >Subject: Re: [E36M3] E36 vs E46 drag race > >Forgive me if this question has been answered, but I'm going to play the >natural skeptic. Josh is claiming 286hp at the rear wheels. What I want to >know is, what else is on the car? The M3 reaches fuel limitations at around >270, and starts to hit intake limitations (stock MAF) at 278 (approx). >Obviously this car was not stock w/cams, but I'd like to know exactly what >was in it. I've seen top notch tuner cars have difficulty hitting those >numbers with any repeatability or reliability-- ones with access to BMW's >tuning equipment. It's a pretty massive stretch to imply that just throwing >in a set of cams will bolt in 46 hp over stock, yet with no other >information supplied as to what is in the car, that's what we're left to >assume. > >I am by no means calling Josh a liar-- I am familiar with the quality of the >product that he sells, and they're definetely top notch. I would just like >complete disclosure of all of the details, so an informed consumer can make >an apples to apples comparison. I welcome comments and rebuttles. > >Sincerely, > >Jason Lombard >Santa Cruz Bicycles, Inc. >831-459-7560 ext. 30 >racebro@santacruzbicycles.com > >www.santacruzbicycles.com
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