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#1. Parts for sale - from John Genereux
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Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 17:56:59 -0700 (PDT) From: John Genereux <white98m3@yahoo.com> Subject: Parts for sale The time has come to sell off some of the parts. 1 set of euro floating "cryo" treated rotor bedded with Cool willys pads. used 1 track day Rotors have almost zero wear pads have about 90% material left. $250 + shipping New Pads $140, rotors $175ea Street setup 1 set of 2 left euro floating CRYO rotors with PF-Z pads Rotors have 90% left and pads have 50% left. $175+shipping UUC Aluminum shift "evo" knob and Ebrake handle $50 + shipping. Email me if your interested. regards, JOHN __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com
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#2. Re: HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) - from Gleb Arshinov
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Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 18:02:03 -0700 From: Gleb Arshinov <gleb@barsook.com> Subject: Re: HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) >>>>> "Skip" == Skip Bogard <skip.bogard@alumni.duke.edu> writes: Skip> San Francisco is well known for its ability to find creative Skip> new uses for lubricants, but not so well known for its Skip> ability to create them. Hehe ;-) However, Chevron's main research facility in next to San Francisco. BMW CCA GGC had a tech session there. Gleb
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#3. Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) - from Joe Dyer
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Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 18:24:41 -0700 From: "Joe Dyer" <joedyer@home.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) Skip -- A valuable lesson in product claims! Thanks. I'm going to pass it along to my car club. Joe Dyer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Skip Bogard" <skip.bogard@alumni.duke.edu> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 3:08 PM Subject: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) | Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 18:04:15 -0400 | From: Skip Bogard <skip.bogard@alumni.duke.edu> | Subject: HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) | | Does this spark plug work? It might. I offer you an approach | to research it that is helpful for me. In fact, if you read until | the end of this note (and put up with my soapbox), you might get | enough of an answer that you need to satisfy your quest for an answer. | | Said another way, I did a lot of the research for you on this spark plug, | and it's all here...so read on: | | HOW TO RESEARCH CLAIMS by an AUTOMOTIVE SUPPLIER | | 1. Find out if a US Patent Number applies to the device by looking on its | instruction sheets, the box, or by writing to the company, or a web site. | | 2. If no patent is held...quit looking and run away <fast>. You have better places | to spend your time. | | 3. If a patent is held for the object of interest (I'm speaking in the US, it's harder | to research foreign held patents, though most BMW or auto patents are filed in the US), | then the patent is probably one of two** major types: | | a. DESIGN PATENT - this is an unsophisticated patent. It just protects | the cosmetic design & appearances of the device. | | Here's an example for a crappy cellular "antenna booster". (btw, RUN! from this) | http://www.delphion.com/details?pn=USD0417221__ | | Note that the only 'claim' of any type made is "The ornamental design of a | clip-on antenna assembly." It does not boost anything except the inventors | wallets. | | BE VERY SKEPTICAL of alleged technical devices that do not make any real | operational "Claims" (See "b." ...the next section immediately below for | patents that do make operational claims) | | b. UTILITY PATENT - this is more sophisticated. It has "Claims" that the | inventor makes that supposedly describe how the device works and are | substantiated by the inventors work. | | Note: There was once a cute library of "obscure" patents | maintained by IBM for no charge on the Internet. One of | these obscure patents was for "perpetual unattended cat feeder". | It consisted of a bird house which lured birds with shake | shingles, shutters and colonial trim, and more ambiance than | a victorian bed & breakfast. Upon entering the bird house door, | no bird could ever escape. The bird would soon die, only to fall | down a trap door leading to a long pipe (the pipe holding up | the bird house...which was hollow and very large in diameter), | and finally the bird fell out an escape chute at the bottom of | the pipe and deposited itself into Felix's cat dish. | | This bird feeder has a real patent, no lie. My point is, while you should RUN | from most design patent devices, you should be skeptical of all utility patents. | Just because a patent was awarded doesn't mean it really works. Or works well. | | ** There is a third type of U.S. patent "PLANT PATENT" (yeah, like the green growing | chlorophyl kind), just in case this becomes your Million Dollar question and you | need me for a lifeline.) | ______________________ | | BACK TO THE SPARK PLUG | | Walla! There is a patent number on this spark plug. It is on the web site URL you | gave me: http://www.inthefuture.com/spark/ and the patent number is #5,610,470. | | We have 1/2 of the way there to answering your question! So before we go further, lets | start another side discussion to make a point...as if the bird feeder example wasn't | enough! | | AUTOMOTIVE PATENTS - On Commoditized Components | | Before getting back to spark plus, let's consider another wonderful commodity we all | love to buy for our cars: OIL ! I promise, this oil thread will be different. | | Let me profess to you that Shell, Chevron, Exxon, Lubrizol, Phillips all have substantial | patent portfolios (simply a collection of patents) on oils, additives, oil chemistry, and | other areas of tribology. One of the more prolific patentees is Chevron in the United | States. It's chief patent enemy is in Europe: BASF Aktiengesellschaft, Ludwigshafen, Germany. | Otherwise known here as simply BASF. And Germany is certainly home of your lovely BMW. | I hear that country has some pretty sharp engineers and scientists! Chemists too. | | But, before I give you the mistaken impression that only big oil companies get patents, let | me assure you there are lots of little companies with impressive patent portfolios too. | Lots of little chemists too...all on their own doing. | | Contrast this with the "chief chemist" at Red Line Oil, Roy Howell (who allegedly left Lubrizol) | who does not have a single patent assigned to him. Nor does Red Line, to the best of | my Patent Search capabilities. Roy never even invented ANYTHING, in or outside the chemistry | field, the engineering field, by working for ANY COMPANY or himself that merited him pursuing | a patent. At least according to U.S. patent history. And now, for some Red Line history. | | The Red Line company was founded by two guys...a former KTVU-TV transmitter engineer and the other a | TV broadcast engineer from San Francisco. San Francisco is well known for its ability | to find creative new uses for lubricants, but not so well known for its ability to create them. | Well...I guess it's where you spend your time that counts. Needless to say, these two guys | probably don't know a whole lot about automotive oil. Yet they left their jobs at a TV | station to form an oil company. Hmmm, I wonder if these guys thought they knew more about | mass marketing? I suspect so... | | And some of you actually buy into this Red Line marketing bullshit that gets fed to everyone... | | Ok, off my soap box. What was the original question? Oh yeah? The spark plug trumpet. I | did a search on the patent server. Here is a link to the patent: | | https://www.delphion.com/details?&pn=US05610470__ | | Some good news...it is a Utility Patent, not a Design Patent. It passes the first Litmus | test....it just might work. Hopefully...it will work better than the bird feeder with | its utility patent. | | If I were researching this...I would next look into whether David Wofsey, the inventor: | 1. Had any other patents or inventions that worked (sort of an intellectual character search) | 2. Had any interesting alliances with others on the Internet (special interest groups, etc). | 3. I'd look at the NGK patent he references in his patent. There could be others that think | this approach might work...who knows what the Japanese are up to at NGK? Who woulda | though you could get rice to combust in the chamber without depositing starch all over | the cylinder walls? | | Colorado (where David Wofsey filed the patent from) might not seem like the epicenter of | automotive research, but then chute...who woulda thought the world's most knowledgeable | tuner of BMW Bosch & Siemens ECU's worked outta Salt Lake City? So give David a break...it's | where he's from...he could be a really smart guy. | | I've read David's patent, and the one thing that makes me skeptical is that while there are lots | of equations presented calculating the range of ultrasonic frequencies that are generated by | this spark plug device (he presents data on the range of sizes of the hole, the velocity of the | gases, etc), there is NOTHING that discusses the acoustic power (in decibels I would presume) | that is either 1. GENERATED and AVAILABLE or 2. NEEDED to atomize additional fuel. Most patents | try to make as many claims as possible as to protect the patent. This seems like a wide open | omission. It leaves him wide open for others to submit slightly different variations on the | patent that might not infringe on it. There is lots of that going on in the patent arena...for | devices that don't even exist yet. One patent seems to superceed or one up the other. This | is presumable for future claims to be used by the marketing department. | | For incredulous examples of these excalating patent wars....do a little patent searching to | see firsthand the stupidity going on in the field of machines to cryogenically treat brake rotors. | I'm not talking about the process. I'm talking about the machines their selling to do this | alchemy bullshit. | | If you really want to see how idiotic these bozos can get....they make claims that "cryogenically | treatinging the brass for a trumpet" or "cryogenically treating guitar strings" make the instruments | sound better. As if a former TV station engineer could really tell. | | - Skip
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#4. SS Noises - from The Buch
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Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 23:51:02 -0700 From: The Buch <the_buch@telus.net> Subject: SS Noises Having just installed the latest UUC short shifter kit in my '99 M3, I note considerably more gear noise and a very slight rattle being transmitted into the car. Any comparisons, or suggestions from other experiences that I have missed something in the installation. Or, is this just a cool new sound to get used to ??
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#5. Performance disclaimer was previously published! - from Christopher J. N. Kolaitis
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Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 07:16:25 -0500 From: "Christopher J. N. Kolaitis" <chrisjnk@ix.netcom.com> Subject: Performance disclaimer was previously published! We all had agreed that the data was too raw and inconsistent for accurate metric use or publication, you might also want to consider it as raw data as well. "There had been some ongoing, general disagreement among the drivers and engineers regarding the quarter mile timings. The timings are not presented here as a definitive set of performance measurement data for publishing, but rather as a good and acceptable measurement of performance for our internal goals and metrics that we had established going into the conversion project." The above quotes are repeated for your recall and review. Chris, Windy City Chapter aka BAADDOG 97 M3/4 Dinan daily driver & grocery getter I can go out, get a loaf of bread and return home faster then anyone in Highland Park, IL
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#6. Re: Gas pedal cover for heel+toe? - from Gleb Arshinov
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Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 18:01:26 -0700 From: Gleb Arshinov <gleb@barsook.com> Subject: Re: Gas pedal cover for heel+toe? >>>>> "Dan" == Dan Miley <dmiley@rcn.com> writes: Dan> I'll be doing my first driving school with my M3 in a week. Dan> I'm thinking that I may want to get a gas pedal cover that Dan> makes it easier to heel and toe. Do you track junkies use Dan> one? Whose pedal do you recommend? I'd plan to only cover Dan> the gas pedal and leave the brake and clutch pedals as they Dan> are. I don't find bigger gas pedal necessary or desirable on M3. If you have very narrow feet/narrow shoes it might be helpful on the street. At the track it is hard *not* to press gass when you are pressing brakes (as you are braking much harder). Dan> I have used a Momo pedal cover on my B5 Passat and it does a Dan> nice job of reducing the huge brake-gas pedal gap. It also Dan> brings the gas pedal up so their heights are closer. Yuh, on my father's Passat and extension would be helpful. Gleb
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#7. Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) - from The Abels
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Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 21:07:46 -0500 From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) The content of the message below on patent-related matters is too replete with errors to address comprehensively in the context of our beloved M3's. However, I did want to comment on a few points: 1. Don't confuse or equate technical merit or efficacy with the existence of patents. There is only a loose correlation, if any. Many companies choose to keep their innovations secret, as in the case of compositions or processes that are not readily reverse engineerable. Further, in the US, a patent may not issue (and be discoverable) for years after the product is in the public domain. 2. The claims of a patent have nothing to do with how a technology works or is 'substantiated.' The claims define the legal metes and bounds (ie, scope) of a patent. The precise meaning of the claims is the core of many millions of dollars in legal fees each year, and is the stuff of the Federal Circuit (the federal court that has subject matter jurisdiction over all patent-related appeals in the US, from the US Patent and Trademark Office, the US Disctrict Courts, and the ITC). 3. As a consumer and bimmerhead, don't get caught up in 'holes' left by a company's patent. This is of little relevance in evaluating a product to add to our machines. 4. Patents do not 'supercede' each other. Again, the legal scope and enforcability have little bearing on whether you should purchase a product covered by a patent. Hope this helps. My apologies for the OT. Feel free to email me privately if you are intersted in discussing any of the finer points of patent procurement, licensing, or enforcement. Jeff Abel 97 M3/4 ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe Dyer <joedyer@home.com> To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 8:28 PM Subject: Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) > Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 18:24:41 -0700 > From: "Joe Dyer" <joedyer@home.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) > > Skip -- A valuable lesson in product claims! Thanks. I'm going to pass it > along to my car club. > > Joe Dyer > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Skip Bogard" <skip.bogard@alumni.duke.edu> > To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> > Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 3:08 PM > Subject: [E36M3] HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark > plugs) > > > | Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2001 18:04:15 -0400 > | From: Skip Bogard <skip.bogard@alumni.duke.edu> > | Subject: HOWTO: Research Automotive Claims was (Re: sonic spark plugs) > | > | Does this spark plug work? It might. I offer you an approach > | to research it that is helpful for me. In fact, if you read until > | the end of this note (and put up with my soapbox), you might get > | enough of an answer that you need to satisfy your quest for an answer. > | > | Said another way, I did a lot of the research for you on this spark plug, > | and it's all here...so read on: > | > | HOW TO RESEARCH CLAIMS by an AUTOMOTIVE SUPPLIER > | > | 1. Find out if a US Patent Number applies to the device by looking on its > | instruction sheets, the box, or by writing to the company, or a web site. > | > | 2. If no patent is held...quit looking and run away <fast>. You have > better places > | to spend your time. > | > | 3. If a patent is held for the object of interest (I'm speaking in the US, > it's harder > | to research foreign held patents, though most BMW or auto patents are > filed in the US), > | then the patent is probably one of two** major types: > | > | a. DESIGN PATENT - this is an unsophisticated patent. It just protects > | the cosmetic design & appearances of the device. > | > | Here's an example for a crappy cellular "antenna booster". (btw, > RUN! from this) > | http://www.delphion.com/details?pn=USD0417221__ > | > | Note that the only 'claim' of any type made is "The ornamental > design of a > | clip-on antenna assembly." It does not boost anything except the > inventors > | wallets. > | > | BE VERY SKEPTICAL of alleged technical devices that do not make any > real > | operational "Claims" (See "b." ...the next section immediately below > for > | patents that do make operational claims) > | > | b. UTILITY PATENT - this is more sophisticated. It has "Claims" that > the > | inventor makes that supposedly describe how the device works and are > | substantiated by the inventors work. > | > | Note: There was once a cute library of "obscure" > patents > | maintained by IBM for no charge on the Internet. One of > | these obscure patents was for "perpetual unattended cat > feeder". > | It consisted of a bird house which lured birds with > shake > | shingles, shutters and colonial trim, and more ambiance > than > | a victorian bed & breakfast. Upon entering the bird > house door, > | no bird could ever escape. The bird would soon die, > only to fall > | down a trap door leading to a long pipe (the pipe > holding up > | the bird house...which was hollow and very large in > diameter), > | and finally the bird fell out an escape chute at the > bottom of > | the pipe and deposited itself into Felix's cat dish. > | > | This bird feeder has a real patent, no lie. My point is, while you > should RUN > | from most design patent devices, you should be skeptical of all > utility patents. > | Just because a patent was awarded doesn't mean it really works. Or > works well. > | > | ** There is a third type of U.S. patent "PLANT PATENT" (yeah, like the > green growing > | chlorophyl kind), just in case this becomes your Million Dollar > question and you > | need me for a lifeline.) > | ______________________ > | > | BACK TO THE SPARK PLUG > | > | Walla! There is a patent number on this spark plug. It is on the web > site URL you > | gave me: http://www.inthefuture.com/spark/ and the patent number is > #5,610,470. > | > | We have 1/2 of the way there to answering your question! So before we go > further, lets > | start another side discussion to make a point...as if the bird feeder > example wasn't > | enough! > | > | AUTOMOTIVE PATENTS - On Commoditized Components > | > | Before getting back to spark plus, let's consider another wonderful > commodity we all > | love to buy for our cars: OIL ! I promise, this oil thread will be > different. > | > | Let me profess to you that Shell, Chevron, Exxon, Lubrizol, Phillips all > have substantial > | patent portfolios (simply a collection of patents) on oils, additives, oil > chemistry, and > | other areas of tribology. One of the more prolific patentees is Chevron > in the United > | States. It's chief patent enemy is in Europe: BASF Aktiengesellschaft, > Ludwigshafen, Germany. > | Otherwise known here as simply BASF. And Germany is certainly home of > your lovely BMW. > | I hear that country has some pretty sharp engineers and scientists! > Chemists too. > | > | But, before I give you the mistaken impression that only big oil companies > get patents, let > | me assure you there are lots of little companies with impressive patent > portfolios too. > | Lots of little chemists too...all on their own doing. > | > | Contrast this with the "chief chemist" at Red Line Oil, Roy Howell (who > allegedly left Lubrizol) > | who does not have a single patent assigned to him. Nor does Red Line, to > the best of > | my Patent Search capabilities. Roy never even invented ANYTHING, in or > outside the chemistry > | field, the engineering field, by working for ANY COMPANY or himself that > merited him pursuing > | a patent. At least according to U.S. patent history. And now, for some > Red Line history. > | > | The Red Line company was founded by two guys...a former KTVU-TV > transmitter engineer and the other a > | TV broadcast engineer from San Francisco. San Francisco is well known > for its ability > | to find creative new uses for lubricants, but not so well known for its > ability to create them. > | Well...I guess it's where you spend your time that counts. Needless to > say, these two guys > | probably don't know a whole lot about automotive oil. Yet they left their > jobs at a TV > | station to form an oil company. Hmmm, I wonder if these guys thought > they knew more about > | mass marketing? I suspect so... > | > | And some of you actually buy into this Red Line marketing bullshit that > gets fed to everyone... > | > | Ok, off my soap box. What was the original question? Oh yeah? The spark > plug trumpet. I > | did a search on the patent server. Here is a link to the patent: > | > | https://www.delphion.com/details?&pn=US05610470__ > | > | Some good news...it is a Utility Patent, not a Design Patent. It passes > the first Litmus > | test....it just might work. Hopefully...it will work better than the > bird feeder with > | its utility patent. > | > | If I were researching this...I would next look into whether David Wofsey, > the inventor: > | 1. Had any other patents or inventions that worked (sort of an > intellectual character search) > | 2. Had any interesting alliances with others on the Internet (special > interest groups, etc). > | 3. I'd look at the NGK patent he references in his patent. There > could be others that think > | this approach might work...who knows what the Japanese are up to at > NGK? Who woulda > | though you could get rice to combust in the chamber without > depositing starch all over > | the cylinder walls? > | > | Colorado (where David Wofsey filed the patent from) might not seem like > the epicenter of > | automotive research, but then chute...who woulda thought the world's most > knowledgeable > | tuner of BMW Bosch & Siemens ECU's worked outta Salt Lake City? So give > David a break...it's > | where he's from...he could be a really smart guy. > | > | I've read David's patent, and the one thing that makes me skeptical is > that while there are lots > | of equations presented calculating the range of ultrasonic frequencies > that are generated by > | this spark plug device (he presents data on the range of sizes of the > hole, the velocity of the > | gases, etc), there is NOTHING that discusses the acoustic power (in > decibels I would presume) > | that is either 1. GENERATED and AVAILABLE or 2. NEEDED to atomize > additional fuel. Most patents > | try to make as many claims as possible as to protect the patent. This > seems like a wide open > | omission. It leaves him wide open for others to submit slightly different > variations on the > | patent that might not infringe on it. There is lots of that going on in > the patent arena...for > | devices that don't even exist yet. One patent seems to superceed or one > up the other. This > | is presumable for future claims to be used by the marketing department. > | > | For incredulous examples of these excalating patent wars....do a little > patent searching to > | see firsthand the stupidity going on in the field of machines to > cryogenically treat brake rotors. > | I'm not talking about the process. I'm talking about the machines their > selling to do this > | alchemy bullshit. > | > | If you really want to see how idiotic these bozos can get....they make > claims that "cryogenically > | treatinging the brass for a trumpet" or "cryogenically treating guitar > strings" make the instruments > | sound better. As if a former TV station engineer could really tell. > | > | - Skip > > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. > GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). > > To issue a command/request to the server: > Send a message with the command you wish executed as the > subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. > ************************************************************* > >
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#8. Looking for a M5 - from Brent95M3@aol.com
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Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2001 22:49:48 EDT From: Brent95M3@aol.com Subject: Looking for a M5 A friend of mine is currently looking for a M5. He would want no more than 20k miles and in anthracite, silver, or black. He is looking for a good deal (obviously, anyone is). If you have any leads, send them my way. Thanks, Brent Parks
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#9. Seat removal E36 M3/4 - from Joseph Lerner
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Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 06:57:13 -0400 From: "Joseph Lerner" <jlaj@msn.com> Subject: Seat removal E36 M3/4 It seems my seat belt latch is loose on my drivers seat. I would like to tighten the bolt but need to remove the seat to do so. The removal seems straight foward except for the seat tensioners. Can anyone help me with the removal of the tensioner, and the correct amount of torque? =20 Thanks in advance=20 Joseph=20
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#10. More on new SS Noises - from The Buch
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Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2001 09:28:59 -0700 From: The Buch <the_buch@telus.net> Subject: More on new SS Noises Since my last post, I find that I am quickly getting used to the new noises introduced by the UUC shortshifter. Plus, this is more than compensated for by the quality of the overall mechanism, the gate-like positive shifting, and the ability to literally feel the syncros working enabling some fine-tuning of technique. Next step will be getting the transmission fluid 'right' (RL D4?). It is notable for list members that when I sent a similar question about noises to UUC, I had a note back from Rob Levinson within hours (on a Saturday!) - talk about great service. With five different products from UUC now in 'the machine' (StrutBarb, TMs, SS, clutchstop, pedal bushings), this company continues to impress. DB ('99 M3)