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#1. Re: [E36M3] NSX - from Michael
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:42:08 -0500 From: "Michael" <95m3ltw@charter.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] NSX Honostly, never seen a fast or well driven NSX at the track. BTW, I have seen about 10 so far. They usually spin by mid morning and are slow all weekend, haha. Very easy car to loop. But I am sure a good driver would be fast in one. Dont worry, if both are well driven, an M3 will hold its on quite easy. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Dargan" <darg01@earthlink.net> > I'm planning a track day with a local NSX Club. > =20 > Anyone know how our M3's will compare????
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#2. RE: [E36M3] LS Prices: Worth it? - from Mel Silva
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 21:48:47 -0600 From: "Mel Silva" <melsilva@mindspring.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] LS Prices: Worth it? Did Somebody say Shelby Club? It is I (and Roger Baker) that are the Shelby Club (and Former Shelby Club) members on the list. Having run with and been instructed by the Shelby Club for years, I was in for the shock of my life the first time I ran with another organization. I was totally unprepared for what other groups consider safe and organized. I cannot recommend them enough, especially for a technical track like Laguna Seca (now known as Mazda Raceway). This event is on Friday so your best bet is to just show up, helmet in hand when the gates open to see if they have space. Scott is a great guy (he runs registration and the website) and depending on how many show up, you should be able to get in a run group. Check www.norcal-saac.org for more info. Mel (lives about 1300 miles from his favorite tracks now, but drives a much nicer car) -----Original Message----- From: jim.bassett@alloptic.com [mailto:jim.bassett@alloptic.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 4:27 PM To: E36M3 Subject: RE: [E36M3] LS Prices: Worth it? Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 14:24:23 -0800 From: jim.bassett@alloptic.com Subject: RE: [E36M3] LS Prices: Worth it? > Just saw that Tracquest has a school going on at Laguna Seca > in April for > $625, including the "lavish banquet" on Saturday night. And their lunches are pretty awesome too. Plus they supply all the water, Gatorade, etc. > LS > always seems to > be in this price range, Especially on a weekend. > but I'm wondering if the two day > schools ever come > in a bit less expensive. NASA is usually a bit less, but it doesn't look like they'll be back to Laguna this year. > They do offer one day for $375, but > I can't see > getting as much benefit out of that track in only one day, unless you > already know it really well (I don't think GT2/GT3 count). ;) TracQuest does offer a good amount of track-time, so don't totally dismiss one-day. > Anyone have suggestions on better-priced LS events, or should > I just jump on > this one? Really want to get be there and not just be > watching. Sorta answers the question, doesn't it? :-) > I think > someone mentioned the Shelby Club before, so I'll look into > that if the > instructors are good. That one showed up last minute - missed it :-( I don't know anything about their instructors really, but see if Roger Baker is there (Roger? Hello?) He's got some mutant E36 that he runs with the Shelby Club, and is also an instructor, I believe. Nice guy, and should be able to hook you up with an instructor. Shelby Club is a pretty good group to run with IMO. Too bad I can't make it on Friday. FWIW, I'll be at the TracQuest event. I tried to sign up as an instructor (instructed with them at BW last year), but wouldn't you know it, they had more than enough instructors for that event (gee, instruct and in return drive Laguna for free :-)). So I'll be there as a student, but will be available to help lend a hand instructing if need be. Cheers, Jim Bassett 1998 M3/4 1993 325is #44 KP ************************************************************* List Commands UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). To issue a command/request to the server: Send a message with the command you wish executed as the subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. *************************************************************
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#3. Re: [E36M3] RE: ABS Problem - 95 M3 - from Michael
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:53:30 -0500 From: "Michael" <95m3ltw@charter.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] RE: ABS Problem - 95 M3 A bad sensor would trigger a default mode which would mean no ABS on any wheel. what is most likely happening, you do have a bad/dirty sensor and the ABS is not working period. Under hard braking you are getting a single rear wheel lock up and thus causing the spin. I had the exact situation at a race in Sebring, one lap brakes/ABS worked fine, next lap under hard braking coming up on 2 911 cup cars at about 120mph, right rear locks up, car INSTANTLY snaps into a spin, missing one of the 911s by inches. I have driven, raced many times with No ABS and never experienced a snap spin like that. I was driving somebody elses car and also figured that there might be a brake caliper issue that was masked by the ABS system when it was working, when it failed the wheel locked prematurely relative to the other wheels. On my LTW which I have used without ABS disabled several times, it never locks a rear, always a front. So you might want to check your brake system beyond just the ABS issue. BTW, the ABS problem was caused by a cut wire going to the right rear sensor. The sensors are a PITA to remove or atleast on that car it was. Mike ----- Original Message ----- > How about a bad sensor (dirty or broken) on the right side? The sensors can go bad or they may just need cleaning as they can get contaminated from road crud.
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#4. Re: [E36M3] NSX - from The Abels
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 21:54:08 -0600 From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] NSX > I'm planning a track day with a local NSX Club. > =20 > Anyone know how our M3's will compare???? > =20 > TIA > =20 > Patrick Dargan > At the track local to me, TWS, the best NSX'ers pull 2:00 laps. That's on par with the fastest spec Miatas. Fast, mostly stock M3s pull around the same times. But, a good friend of mine, who is a BMW CCA club racer doesn't have the most respect for the NSX's, and pulled 1:56's his second time on this track, faster than any NSX I know of and right around some of the faster guys in Z06s and Vipers. His car makes stock-ish power, runs race springs, revalved bilsteins, Toyo's, and full roll cage. I passed along your message, and here's the text of his response. Bear in mind, he's talented, young, fast and cocky. Please don't take it too seriously ;) -------------------- haha! don't make me laugh! I guess NSX's aren't that bad a car on paper.. never driven one. but i have yet to see one driven by a real competent driver. Seen all kinds of these cars, big wings, superchargers w/ intercoolers, big wheels, sticky tires, racing seats, harnesses, etc...it's all for show, just an extension of their ricer boy heritage. They talk all this stuff about hitting 150 on the straight, blah blah blah... then why do the hold me up in the turns?! I think these guys are wimpier than Porsche drivers! I guess it makes sense what an expensive car and a guy in loafers, khakis, and polo shirt will/won't do at the track... really the type that like to 'drive the line'. heh, whatever that is! I've run an event with the Florida NSX club at Atlanta Motor Speedway, pretty good group of people, and they run it kinda loose, which I like. No defined run groups really... not good for newbie drivers. Most intermediate and above drivers were soloed for the entire event. Lots of S2000 guys there, they are funny cuz they think they have a fast car and can drive like F1 racer or something. Quite a few Audi TT and S4/A4 people too, they were funny becuase they were in so much denial that they weren't driving fat bloated pig dog cars. Saw more than a few take out some cones and climb the banking almost smacking the walls. M3's RULE!!! (in my best O'Doyle voice) P.S. Is that good enough Jeff? ;-)
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#5. RE: [E36M3] Note about PowerFlex bushings - from Greg Cernosek
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 21:50:54 -0600 From: "Greg Cernosek" <gcernosek@inetx.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Note about PowerFlex bushings It is certainly possible that they were damaged during installation. I wouldn't know because I didn't install them myself. I had a local race-oriented shop install them. This possibility is one reason I tried not to bash the bushings themselves in my original post. Greg -----Original Message----- From: The Abels [mailto:aAbel@austin.rr.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 6:47 PM To: E36M3 Subject: Re: [E36M3] Note about PowerFlex bushings Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 18:43:26 -0600 From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Note about PowerFlex bushings > Group, > > I just wanted to tell everyone who has the Powerflex bushings on their car > to check them out. I have had the front control arm bushings and rear > trailing arm bushings on my car for about 2 weeks now. Last night, I got > under the car for a little inspection and saw that one of the front control > arm bushings was torn already. I have only been to the track once with > these bushings and have only driven the car on the street about 5 different > times (other than the trip to MSR). <snip> > Greg > 98 M3, Dallas, TX Greg, Thanks for the heads up. Like Kit, I was recently under my car and noticed no issues with mine. I'll have a tech inspection done next week for an upcoming event, and will check again. Could they have gotten torn during the install? Jeff 97 M3/4, still happily Powerflexed
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#6. RE: [E36M3] H&Rs and powerflex bushings - from Greg Cernosek
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 21:54:13 -0600 From: "Greg Cernosek" <gcernosek@inetx.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] H&Rs and powerflex bushings Kit, I have the centered ones. I will follow up with more info after I get the new ones installed. Greg -----Original Message----- From: kitwetzler@mindspring.com [mailto:kitwetzler@mindspring.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 4:17 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] H&Rs and powerflex bushings Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 17:11:03 -0500 From: "kitwetzler@mindspring.com" <kitwetzler@mindspring.com> Subject: H&Rs and powerflex bushings > not (yet) come to that conclusion. I just know that there has been much > discussion on this subject and want everyone who has them to take a few > minutes to inspect theirs just in case. Do you have the offset bushings or the centered ones? Mine have been fine for 8K street miles, and 1 track event at Laguna... Just looked at mine yesterday and they are fine. hopefully the one you got had a defect... please keep us posted if you have any other issues! -kit
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#7. Re: [E36M3] NSX - from Michael
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 23:07:09 -0500 From: "Michael" <95m3ltw@charter.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] NSX That reply had to have come from Mel? lol ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> > I passed along your message, and here's the text of his response. Bear in > mind, he's talented, young, fast and cocky. Please don't take it too > seriously ;)
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#8. Re: [E36M3] H&R progressive springs; was oops - from Zack Steinkamp
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 20:15:50 -0800 (PST) From: Zack Steinkamp <edsarkiss@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] H&R progressive springs; was oops --- David Bauer <dbauer@blkbox.com> wrote: > My H&R coilovers have 29936 VA stamped on the front > springs. Not sure > what's on the rears... 29936 HA on the rears here... i recall someone saying that the H&R Coilover kit has linear rate springs. this is incorrect. they're progressive. -zs __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com
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#9. RE: [E36M3] NSX - from Mel Silva
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:32:51 -0600 From: "Mel Silva" <melsilva@mindspring.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] NSX No way! I didn't write that. However, I have seen my fair share of NSX's pointed the wrong way at track events :P Mel -----Original Message----- From: Michael [mailto:95m3ltw@charter.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 10:17 PM To: E36M3 Subject: Re: [E36M3] NSX Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 23:07:09 -0500 From: "Michael" <95m3ltw@charter.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] NSX That reply had to have come from Mel? lol ----- Original Message ----- From: "The Abels" <aAbel@austin.rr.com> > I passed along your message, and here's the text of his response. Bear in > mind, he's talented, young, fast and cocky. Please don't take it too > seriously ;) ************************************************************* List Commands UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). To issue a command/request to the server: Send a message with the command you wish executed as the subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. *************************************************************
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#10. Re: H&R progressive springs; was oops - from Ron Katona
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Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 23:42:08 -0500 From: Ron Katona <rkatona@bellatlantic.net> Subject: Re: H&R progressive springs; was oops alex.fadeev@verizon.com wrote: > OK, I'll bite: does anyone else find the concepts of coil-over (aka height > adjustable) setup and progressive springs mutually exclusive? > How do you predict spring compression rates and their front/rear > relationship when you adjust the height on progressive springs? > You should end up with stiffer all around springs, but do the rears stiffen > up at the same rate as the fronts? Does that same correlation hold > throughout the adjustment range? If not, the car would be a handful to > setup. I think you're overcomplicating it. Forget corner balance for the moment. If you change ride height equally on all four corners, any spring, progressive rate or not, will be at exactly the same rate as when you started. You can't change spring rate, wheel rate, wheel frequency, or installed height by raising or lowering the car. The spring is sitting there dumb as a rock compressed exactly the same amount given the weight on that corner of the car multiplied by the motion ratio of the suspension. That is independent of overall ride height. Raising or lowering the spring perches will change ride height, but not installed height. It's installed height (the length of the spring installed and under load) that determines where in its progressive range the spring falls. If you raise or lower the entire car 1/8" there will be NO changes in spring rate at any wheel. Think of it this way... put the spring in your palm and then place a 50 lb weight on top. Now raise your palm. Has the spring rate changed? No. Installed height change? No. Did it matter if the spring was progressive or not? No. Now, when you go to corner balance with progressive rate springs it might be more difficult because now you're moving weight around in a system of springs. You'll get a non-linear change in diagonal weight transfer in relation to a ride height change at any corner because the springs are non-linear. Note this is different from above where all four perches are being moved at the same time/same direction. This will change the installed height slightly on opposite corners - one goes up and one goes down. I still don't think it will be that much harder to set up than a linear spring though. Just have to understand that if you're last 1/8" (for example) adjustment of a spring perch moved 25 lb from one corner to the opposite corner, the next 1/8" might move 35 lb... not a big deal. In practice, unless the car is totally out of balance for some reason, I doubt the slight variation in installed height (and therefore spring rate) after corner balancing will be enough to be of any significance. Or maybe I'm missing your point. ;) -- Ron Katona