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#1. Re: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Steve Grigory
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 12:21:39 -0700 From: Steve Grigory <sgrigory@pacbell.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Brake ducting options Peter, I ducted my front brakes last year and posted a write-up on Suzy's web site if you'd like to check it out. http://www.bmw-m.net/TechProc/brake_duct.htm steve
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#2. Brake ducting options - from Dorffer, Rich
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:35:23 -0400 From: "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> Subject: Brake ducting options Peter asks > > I'm replacing rotors due to some very small radial cracking, no other wear > issues. I already use track pads (PF90's), high temp fluid (Motul), cryo > the front rotors (two piece) and have good braking technique. This has > solved all the fade, warp, boil, etc. concerns. I'm hoping the ducting > will solve the radial cracking. I agree with the Bimmer World recommendations but I haven't done it myself either. I am more curious what rotors you are using. Since you mentioned radial cracks, I assume you are using a cross drilled rotor such as the Brembos. If this is the case, aren't the radial cracks a sign of wear combined with the stress from the drilling of the rotors. Are these true floating rotors or simply two piece (aluminum hat attached to the rotor)? Would keeping the rotors cooler do anything to help prevent these cracks? I am not so sure. I am not convinced of cryo treating either so I am not sure if has any bearing on anything (other than spending more money). Later, Rich
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#3. Re: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Chester Wong
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 12:42:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Brake ducting options Hmmm....I have a question: Instead of spending $250 for backing plates, why can't you just use the stock backing plate, cut a hole in it and tack weld a steel tube to the hole? I just think it's outrageous for backing plates to cost that much. Well, that's just me. Chester --- "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> wrote: > I agree with the Bimmer World recommendations but I haven't done it myself > either. I am more curious what rotors you are using. Since you mentioned > radial cracks, I assume you are using a cross drilled rotor such as the > Brembos. If this is the case, aren't the radial cracks a sign of wear > combined with the stress from the drilling of the rotors. Are these true > floating rotors or simply two piece (aluminum hat attached to the rotor)? ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup.yahoo.com
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#4. Re: Brake ducting options - from Neil Maller
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 14:56:15 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: Brake ducting options on 6/19/02 2:07 PM, Peter Fanning <p.fanning@verizon.net> wrote: > I'm looking for input regarding brake ducting options for use on a '98 > M3/4. I would like to retain the road lights, be able to remove the hose > for street use and not have to replace the wheel bearings to install the > backing plates. Then your best and only off the shelf option is from Bimmerworld (www.bimmerworld.com) who makes the only brake backing plates I know of that don't require pulling the wheel hub. Furthermore theirs is an excellently designed and made kit, although the installation instructions could use some work). Around $400. I've been using this for a couple of years, and as a test have measured well over 200 degrees temperature drop between vented and non-vented sides. Neil 96 M3
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#5. RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Dorffer, Rich
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:58:01 -0400 From: "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options I would certainly think many people could just fabricate there own using the existing backing plates for the most part. I have seen a couple of different home-made set-ups on E30 M3s and E36 M3s for that matter. Some attempted to attach to the stock backing plates and others simply added ducting which did not attach to the backing plates at but simply attempted to direct more air into the general area. I will probably end up doing something very similar to one home-made set-up I saw some day, with or without the backing plates, I am not sure yet. My stock set-up is apparently working pretty well at the tracks I visit based on the ambient temperatures and my braking technique. I don't know if $250 is too much or not considering the potential savings in brake pads and rotors, especially when people often buy track pads, floating rotors, cryo treated rotors, cross-drilled rotors, etc. which are all quite pricey. The backing plates are a one-time purchase, all the brake components are consumables. Why do people spend huge $$$$ on Movit/Porsche kits? I just think it is outrageous what these brakes cost. Well, that's just me. ;-) Later, Rich Chester says > > Hmmm....I have a question: Instead of spending $250 for backing plates, why > can't you just use the stock backing plate, cut a hole in it and tack weld a > steel tube to the hole? > I just think it's outrageous for backing plates to cost that much. Well, > that's just me.
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#6. RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Chester Wong
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 13:03:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options Hmmm....I didn't say backing plates don't offer a potential savings...they do! I was saying that $250 for circular pieces of metal with a tube connected to it might be a bit much. I don't understand the big brakes either. Considering you can get the calipers for ~$300 each, I guess it's liability and profit. Go figure. But the way it is for me, I can use the brakes, and when I'm done with them...can sell them and recover some, if not all, of my investment. Chester --- "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> wrote: > I don't know if $250 is too much or not considering the potential savings in > brake pads and rotors, especially when people often buy track pads, floating > rotors, cryo treated rotors, cross-drilled rotors, etc. which are all quite > pricey. The backing plates are a one-time purchase, all the brake components > are consumables. > > Why do people spend huge $$$$ on Movit/Porsche kits? I just think it is > outrageous what these brakes cost. Well, that's just me. ;-) ===== __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTax http://taxes.yahoo.com/
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#7. RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Andrew-Taylor Autosport
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 16:02:45 -0400 From: "Andrew-Taylor Autosport" <astaylor@taylorautosport.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options > Hmmm....I have a question: Instead of spending $250 for backing > plates, why > can't you just use the stock backing plate, cut a hole in it and > tack weld a > steel tube to the hole? That just doesn't cut it in arduous conditions. Then you're just cooling the inside face of the disc, which will lead to more stress and worse cracking. The Bimmerworld solution is the best thing out there that's a simple bolt on mod that fits and looks nice, and works. It properly directs air to the center of the rotor. It's an industry standard of brake ducting...e.g. AP racing's technical department recommends that of the cooling air ducted to the rotor, 80% go to the inside of the disc, and then an equal 10% go to each face. I've been using them for a while, in fact, I have the second set of Stainless (the third set of plates) that Barry at Bimmerworld made. Mine aren't even powder coated... Andrew http://www.taylorautosport.com/
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#8. RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from Dorffer, Rich
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 16:18:55 -0400 From: "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options > Hmmm....I didn't say backing plates don't offer a potential savings...they do! > I was saying that $250 for circular pieces of metal with a tube connected to it > might be a bit much. I can think of many things that seem overpriced until you start figuring out what it costs to produce, limited market demand, labor costs, tool & equipment costs, etc. For example, there isn't much to Steve D's jacking plate but I doubt he is getting filthy rich from it. I doubt Bimmer World is making a living from backing plates either (or any other company that makes them). Have you ever seen what the carbon fiber brake ducts cost?!?! Yikes. > I don't understand the big brakes either. Considering you can get the calipers > for ~$300 each, I guess it's liability and profit. Go figure. But the way it > is for me, I can use the brakes, and when I'm done with them...can sell them > and recover some, if not all, of my investment. I think the same could potentially be said about the backing plates too. Could be why most people part out their aftermarket stuff on their cars rather than selling their cars with the stuff on them. eBay makes this all possible as well. Later, Rich - Currently on a spending freeze until I get my 325is working again.
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#9. RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options - from alex.fadeev@verizon.com
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:19:26 -0500 From: alex.fadeev@verizon.com Subject: RE: [E36M3] Brake ducting options "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> wrote: > > Why do people spend huge $$$$ on Movit/Porsche kits? I just think it is > outrageous what these brakes cost. Well, that's just me. ;-) Rich, It's perfectly simple: chicks love MABOGBB's: Middle Aged Balding Overweight Guys with Big Brakes. ;-))) Repeat above as necessary to ease the pain in your wallet... alex f Chester says > > Hmmm....I have a question: Instead of spending $250 for backing plates, why > can't you just use the stock backing plate, cut a hole in it and tack weld a > steel tube to the hole? > I just think it's outrageous for backing plates to cost that much. Well, > that's just me.
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#10. Motor City Driver School at MIS July 13-14 - from Neil Maller
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 15:25:56 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Motor City Driver School at MIS July 13-14 There are still student spots available for Motor City's school at Michigan International Speedway over the July 13-14 weekend. For info and application forms surf over to www.motorcitybmwcca.org and follow the Events link. MIS is located in Brooklyn, MI, a couple of hours drive west of Detroit. This is the famous banked oval track used by NASCAR, IRL and CART. The road course runs through the infield and joins the oval at NASCAR turn 3, runs through turn 4 and down the main straight, then dives back into the infield. It's a big fun track, and motoring around the banked oval portion is a never to be forgotten experience! If you're within driving distance and not going to O'fest in Colorado, MIS is the place to be, so get your apps in now! Neil 96 M3