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#1. Re: [E36M3] Radiator problems - from Jim Bassett
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Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 10:42:05 -0700 From: Jim Bassett <jimbassett@attbi.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Radiator problems At 06:50 PM 10/7/02, Chris Teague wrote: >So is my radiator shot? Sounds like it. >Should I just order the cooling kit from Bimmerparts.com with the >aluminum radiator housing? Aluminum thermostat housing? Might as well. >Anything else I should replace >while I am at it? You might want to consider changing the water pump. Although you most likely have a metal impeller one, they can still fail and/or leak over time. At around 50,000 miles, I had the radiator replaced (small leak similar to what you describe) and a few thousand miles later had to replace the water pump since it was starting to leak from the center bearing. Cheers, Jim Bassett
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#2. Driver's ed aftermath - from Zachary Eyler-Walker
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 13:45:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Eyler-Walker <zwalker@cs.utk.edu> Subject: Driver's ed aftermath I was at a PCA event at VIR south and full course last weekend, and have some questions. First, I warped my rotors. Again. On the south course. Again. This was only my second event, and when this happened last time I solicited advice about how to avoid warping the rotors in the future. Basically, I was told to use the brakes hard and fast, for the minimum time, rather than riding them more softly and not allowing them time to cool down. I was close to threshold at all major braking points, sometimes (rarely) touching ABS. And the bastards warped anyway. In retrospect, my rotors only got hosed at my first event once I started braking hard and deep, not when I was still getting a clue and starting braking before the first marker. I was using Hawk HPS, which are pretty lame on the track. Not obviously better than stock. They get extremely greasy after just a couple hard stops from 120+, and I had to really stand on the brakes to get the car to slow down fast. Anyway, what next? Euro rotors (which, at 2.5x the cost, will hurt a lot more to replace if they also warp)? Track pads (Maybe porterfield R4, since I don't want to have to sandblast my bodywork to get the dust off)? Cooling kit, or just remove the dust shields? Or is there some other technique oriented thing I should try? Also, is it dangerous to run with the warped rotors, or can I get away with it? I ran all day on the full course with no noticeable side effects apart from a little shudder. The other thing is that I am now down an inch or two of coolant in the tank. Should this concern me, or should I just dump in some distilled water and not worry about it? There are no drips or superficially obvious leaks, and the temp gauge was rock solid at 50% the whole time I was out. Fun weekend, despite these issues. I was turning what seemed like very respectable laps and lap times, I met some cool people, and I feel like I learned a lot. Thanks, Zach
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#3. too far a drive? - from Paul Elliott
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:15:24 -0400 From: "Paul Elliott" <elliott.paul@worldnet.att.net> Subject: too far a drive? >>have good driving tunes. Just remember to pull over if you do start to nod off, it's just as dangerous as driving drunk.<< I know...Thats what Im most afraid of.. Maybe I should get one of those devices thats supposed to shock you or something if your head starts to tilt to one side :--) Paul Elliott --------------------------------------------------------- '99 White M3; 45K miles; Dinan stage II SC kit with 6" RMS crank pulley: 11 psi; AA Aquamist Water/Methanol Injection; Fikse FM-10s; X-Brace; Dinan Koni Suspension; Stygar SS and Clutch Stop; Sound by Polk, Excelon, JLAudio
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#4. Re: As the Rotor Turns.... - from Neil Maller
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Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 13:12:15 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: As the Rotor Turns.... on 10/9/02 12:50 PM, "Riley, Scott" <sriley@cardinalcapital.com> wrote: > I have 2 pairs of "previously used" Euro rotors in my garage for my '95 M3. > Both pairs have less than 1k miles on them. As I was trying different racing > pads (Pagid, Hawk, etc.), I purchased new rotors each time to make it an > accurate comparison. Now, that I've settled on Hawk Blues, I want to use > these other rotors as backups at the track for club racing. I thought that it > would be a good idea to turn them ever so slightly to freshen them up. I am > aware that there is a min. thickness, but I am no where near it at this point. > > First question, does this sound like a good plan? I know, for example, that > MB does NOT recommend turning rotors, at least not on my wife's CLK. > > Secondly, where is a good place to have this done? The last time I turned a > rotor was in shop class back in high school. > > Thirdly, how much should I take off? There is very little buildup, if any, on > the rotors. Scott, You can do this, although it really may not be necessary. However "turning" usually refers to using a lathe, often a specialized brake lathe, which takes of significant amounts of metal. BMW says not to turn their rotors. Instead you want to have a light random grind done, which will just clean up the surface, leaving a fine cross-hatch finish. This is ideal for what you want and removes hardly any material. Grinding uses an abrasive wheel rather than a lathe's cutting tool. There's a NAPA store near me which does this for $14 per rotor. Call around to automotive machine shops in your area until you find someone set up to do it. Neil 96 M3
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#5. RE: [E36M3] Driver's ed aftermath - from Carey Probst
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:45:12 -0400 From: "Carey Probst" <hcprobst@nycap.rr.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Driver's ed aftermath OK, soapbox time. Are you SURE that the rotors are warped and not just vibrating due to pad build up? I have never left an event at Watkins Glen that I didn't think my rotors had warped. Usually within 500 miles or so with light braking to buff up the surfaces, they returned to normal. I have never had to replace a rotor in 12 days at the Glen and 1 at NHIS but have driven home many times with pad build up and vibration. I brake late and hard at the Glen and definitely get some build up. Try riding the brake under power for short distances to buff the rotors and remove the pad material before you start spending on new rotors. Carey Probst, '99 M3/2, BMW CCA Patroon and Genesee Valley Chapters JC CAIed and Sharked, Stressed, Schrothed, Gauged, Hitched, X-Braced A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -----Original Message----- From: Zachary Eyler-Walker [mailto:zwalker@cs.utk.edu] Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 1:51 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] Driver's ed aftermath Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 13:45:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Eyler-Walker <zwalker@cs.utk.edu> Subject: Driver's ed aftermath I was at a PCA event at VIR south and full course last weekend, and have some questions. First, I warped my rotors. Again. On the south course. Again. This was only my second event, and when this happened last time I solicited advice about how to avoid warping the rotors in the future. Basically, I was told to use the brakes hard and fast, for the minimum time, rather than riding them more softly and not allowing them time to cool down. I was close to threshold at all major braking points, sometimes (rarely) touching ABS. And the bastards warped anyway. In retrospect, my rotors only got hosed at my first event once I started braking hard and deep, not when I was still getting a clue and starting braking before the first marker. I was using Hawk HPS, which are pretty lame on the track. Not obviously better than stock. They get extremely greasy after just a couple hard stops from 120+, and I had to really stand on the brakes to get the car to slow down fast. Anyway, what next? Euro rotors (which, at 2.5x the cost, will hurt a lot more to replace if they also warp)? Track pads (Maybe porterfield R4, since I don't want to have to sandblast my bodywork to get the dust off)? Cooling kit, or just remove the dust shields? Or is there some other technique oriented thing I should try? Also, is it dangerous to run with the warped rotors, or can I get away with it? I ran all day on the full course with no noticeable side effects apart from a little shudder. The other thing is that I am now down an inch or two of coolant in the tank. Should this concern me, or should I just dump in some distilled water and not worry about it? There are no drips or superficially obvious leaks, and the temp gauge was rock solid at 50% the whole time I was out. Fun weekend, despite these issues. I was turning what seemed like very respectable laps and lap times, I met some cool people, and I feel like I learned a lot. Thanks, Zach ************************************************************* List Commands UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). To issue a command/request to the server: Send a message with the command you wish executed as the subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. *************************************************************
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#6. RE: [E36M3] too far a drive? - from Carey Probst
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:47:45 -0400 From: "Carey Probst" <hcprobst@nycap.rr.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] too far a drive? That's what the Armco and Jersey barriers between lanes are for. They will wake you up quick. So do the little rumble strips on the NY Thruway when you get a little wide. Just like cutting the apex at the Glen. Carey Probst, '99 M3/2, BMW CCA Patroon and Genesee Valley Chapters JC CAIed and Sharked, Stressed, Schrothed, Gauged, Hitched, X-Braced A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -----Original Message----- From: Paul Elliott [mailto:elliott.paul@worldnet.att.net] Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 2:20 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] too far a drive? Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:15:24 -0400 From: "Paul Elliott" <elliott.paul@worldnet.att.net> Subject: too far a drive? >>have good driving tunes. Just remember to pull over if you do start to nod off, it's just as dangerous as driving drunk.<< I know...Thats what Im most afraid of.. Maybe I should get one of those devices thats supposed to shock you or something if your head starts to tilt to one side :--) Paul Elliott --------------------------------------------------------- '99 White M3; 45K miles; Dinan stage II SC kit with 6" RMS crank pulley: 11 psi; AA Aquamist Water/Methanol Injection; Fikse FM-10s; X-Brace; Dinan Koni Suspension; Stygar SS and Clutch Stop; Sound by Polk, Excelon, JLAudio ************************************************************* List Commands UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). To issue a command/request to the server: Send a message with the command you wish executed as the subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. *************************************************************
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#7. JC intake vs PAR intake - from DocWyte
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:55:19 -0700 (PDT) From: DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> Subject: JC intake vs PAR intake Ok, Here's the deal. I have the chance to pick up a used JC euro hfm intake setup locally. However, my friend Pete makes the PAR intake setup, which I've heard is pretty nice and very similar to the ECIS setup. Price difference between the two is $150. Is it worth the extra cash to get the JC intake? Both have heat shields, etc. -josh ===== Josh Wyte Momentum Motorsports 508-833-3024 After 5 pm EST __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com
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#8. A032R Chunked - from David Foos
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 14:44:41 -0500 From: David Foos <David.Foos@prairiecomm.com> Subject: A032R Chunked Hi All, I'm new to the list although I've been around the 'club' for a while. (Note: this was also x-posted to the UUCDigest) During the Motor City School this weekend at Grattan, I corded my Left-Front A032R tire (turn 1). The set was brand new, with the exception of being heat cycled and 'scrubbed-in' one evening at Gingerman. I was a bit surprised by the way the tire separated into evenly spaced sections, approximately 2x2" in size. Has anyone ever seen this before (see link below)? http://my.core.com/~mfoos/bad_tire.jpg I'm still running stock camber, and I know I need to add some additional camber for the track. How much should I be shooting for? I'm guessing around -3 deg. -Dave 95 M3 BTW: The MC school this weekend was great fun! Thanks to anyone who was involved in its preparation/operation.
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#9. Re: [E36M3] As the Rotor Turns.... - from cteague@cox.net
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 15:56:25 -0400 From: <cteague@cox.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] As the Rotor Turns.... Scott, If they are true, and have little build up, then what I have done is take them to the local autoparts/machine shop, and have them buffed up. Not sure what they call that, but basically they don't cut any metal, they just grind them with a powered wire brush to remove any deposits, and get them ready for fresh pads to bed in. Chris > > Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:21:43 -0500 > From: "Riley, Scott" <sriley@cardinalcapital.com> > Subject: As the Rotor Turns.... > > I have 2 pairs of "previously used" Euro rotors in my garage for my '95 M3. Both pairs have less than 1k miles on them. As I was trying different racing pads (Pagid, Hawk, etc.), I purchased new rotors each time to make it an accurate comparison. Now, that I've settled on Hawk Blues, I want to use these other rotors as backups at the track for club racing. I thought that it would be a good idea to turn them ever so slightly to freshen them up. I am aware that there is a min. thickness, but I am no where near it at this point. > > First question, does this sound like a good plan? I know, for example, that MB does NOT recommend turning rotors, at least not on my wife's CLK. > > Secondly, where is a good place to have this done? The last time I turned a rotor was in shop class back in high school. > > Thirdly, how much should I take off? There is very little buildup, if any, on the rotors.
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#10. WTB: Factory Rear Spoiler (Coupe not 4 Door) - from Riley, Scott
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 15:05:34 -0500 From: "Riley, Scott" <sriley@cardinalcapital.com> Subject: WTB: Factory Rear Spoiler (Coupe not 4 Door) Anyone have one of these lying around after upgrading to the LTW version? Other than having a clean mounting surface, condition of paint is not terribly important. Prefer Cosmos Black, but any color will work. I need it within the next 2 weeks. Thanks, Scott Dallas, Texas
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#11. Re: [E36M3] As the Rotor Turns.... - from Dave Kelley
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 16:06:57 -0400 From: "Dave Kelley" <d.kelley@usa.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] As the Rotor Turns.... I don't know what kind of driving you do, but I have turned stock M3 rotors and used them on the track with both Hawk HP+ and Hawk Blues with no problems. I can't see any scientific reason that turning them would be a problems as long as you are above minimum thickness and I have a degree in Metallurgical Engineering! Dave Kelley > Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:21:43 -0500 > From: "Riley, Scott" <sriley@cardinalcapital.com> > Subject: As the Rotor Turns.... > > I have 2 pairs of "previously used" Euro rotors in my garage for my '95 M3. Both pairs have less than 1k miles on them. As I was trying different racing pads (Pagid, Hawk, etc.), I purchased new rotors each time to make it an accurate comparison. Now, that I've settled on Hawk Blues, I want to use these other rotors as backups at the track for club racing. I thought that it would be a good idea to turn them ever so slightly to freshen them up. I am aware that there is a min. thickness, but I am no where near it at this point. > > First question, does this sound like a good plan? I know, for example, that MB does NOT recommend turning rotors, at least not on my wife's CLK. > > Secondly, where is a good place to have this done? The last time I turned a rotor was in shop class back in high school. > > Thirdly, how much should I take off? There is very little buildup, if any, on the rotors. > > TIA, > Scott > > > ************************************************************* > List Commands > UNSUBSCRIBE - (in subject line) unsubscribes you from the mailing list. > DIR - sends a listing of files available in the list's GET directory. > GET filename1.ext,filename2.ext - sends the requested file(s). > > To issue a command/request to the server: > Send a message with the command you wish executed as the > subject of the message to the email address e36m3@bmw-m.net. > ************************************************************* > > >
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#12. RE: [E36M3] Driver's ed aftermath - from Zachary Eyler-Walker
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Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 18:06:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Eyler-Walker <zwalker@cs.utk.edu> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Driver's ed aftermath On Wed, 9 Oct 2002, Carey Probst wrote: > OK, soapbox time. > > Are you SURE that the rotors are warped and not just vibrating due to pad > build up? Yes, I've read about this pad build up idea, and no, I'm not SURE that the rotors are actually warped. It is technically possible that they're not warped, and are just covered with melted brake pad. I do know that the last time at VIR South, the symptoms were exactly the same and three months of varied driving resulted in minimal change. That was with the stock pads, though, not the Hawk HPS. I don't intend to rush out and replace the rotors immediately, so if I'm lucky things will sort themselves out. Thanks for the suggestion. Zach