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#1. The 'Eyes' Have It?? - from The Buch
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 08:04:46 -0800 From: The Buch <the_buch@telus.net> Subject: The 'Eyes' Have It?? There seems to be a bit of a 'battle' brewing over the best approach to Angel Eyes. JP is announcing a new generation with more light output using fiber. Lava appears to be going another route (on their own) but are not yet fully discosing their technology. All the variations and generations leads me to conclude that this upgrade is not quite there yet?? I would be interested in hearing any opinions and degrees of satisfaction with different setups. Thanks, Doug
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#2. Electric fan controls - from John Pease
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 12:56:43 -0800 (PST) From: John Pease <john_pease123@yahoo.com> Subject: Electric fan controls With the electric fan thread in full swing I would like to ask what people think of an alternative fan control scheme. All of the electric fans I have seen are controlled by a relay. It is pretty hard to beat a relay, its cheap and reliable. The problem is that these fans draw a lot of current and you only have two speed choices fully on or off. I think that it would be easy to implement a proportional fan control that would command fan speed (and current draw) based on the coolant temperature. This fan controller could also have a maximum current limit to avoid over-stressing the vehicles electrical system. Cost is the biggest problem with this idea. Such a controller would have to retail for at least $100 - not good when compared to a $10 relay. Do any of you feel that it is worth the extra money to have a variable speed fan control with temperature input? Thank you John Pease __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com
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#3. Re: [E36M3] Thompson BMW Sertvice NIGHTMARE (very long) - from Tom Byrum
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 15:59:12 -0500 From: Tom Byrum <mycroft@academus.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Thompson BMW Sertvice NIGHTMARE (very long) Chris, I live just outside King of Prussia, PA. In the area I believe Otto's BMW in West Chester and Don Rosen are well regarded. I've not had good experience with Devon Hill (in my E30, they may know an E36 better) and no experience with Thompson aside from the constant stream of radio commercials touting their service. I have taken my cars to Mike Yaskin at Bavarian Specialties in King of Prussia for all non DIY or warrantee work. He is the best independant BMW specialist in the area to my knowledge. On my E30 he diagnosed and repaired in 3 hours what Devon couldn't do over two service appointments. Bavarian Specialties (610) 277-6035 340 East Church Road King Of Prussia, PA 19406 Hope this helps, and welcome to the area. If you haven't already, join the Deleware Valley CCA chapter. We've got a number of DEs and other events over the course of the year. Tom Byrum "Chris Conner" <chris@digital7.com> wrote: (01/28/2003 19:13) >Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 19:05:43 -0500 >From: "Chris Conner" <chris@digital7.com> >Subject: Thompson BMW Sertvice NIGHTMARE (very long) > > >My 99 Certified Pre-Owned m3 has developed a transmission problem. It >has 55k miles on it, and was purchased with a Certified Pre-Owned >warranty. Yesterday, I took the car to Thompson BMW in Doylestown, PA. I >recently moved to PA, and it is my first experience with this dealer. >I'm curious to get some other opinions on my experience, before I type >everything up. Here are a few paraphrased conversations I've had with >"Wayne", the service advisor dealing with my car. None of the points >made below have been exaggerated in any way. > >First call, after I dropped off the car: > >them: just to let you know, we're going to have to spend some money to >work on this car.=20 >me: no, it is certified pre-owned.=20 >them: what do you know about the car?=20 >me: what do you want to know?=20 >them: the tranmission has been out of the car. >me: not to the best of my knowledge.=20 >them: did you buy the car new? >me: no, it is certified pre-owned. >them: well it's a little "tricked out" (ed note. the car has H&R >Race/Bilsteins/JTD RSMs/Borbet Wheels/Ellipsoids/Aftermarket Brakes) >me: okay, the trans has not been modified. >them: did you buy it from a bmw dealer?=20 >me: it is CERTIFIED PRE OWNED. >them: we'll call you tomorrow > >I was astounded by this conversation. Either he does not understand what >CPO means, or he was strongly implying that the car is not actually CPO. > > >second call, the next morning: >they say they will not fix or replace the tranny, he says this, and I >quote: "there was no fluid in the transmission"=20 >me: "no fluid, in the transmission?"=20 >them: "yes, and it is the wrong kind too"=20 >me: how did you check the level of fluid in a bmw manual trans? >Them: we used a special tool >Me: what tool did you use? >Them: the technician put his finger in the fill plug and could not feel >oil > >The latest BMW special tool is now a technician's finger! A month ago, >after this noise in my trans developed, I drained the stock BMW fluid >(there was a correct amount in the trans) and filled it with the >required amount (fill until it overflows from the fill plug on level >ground) of spec transmission fluid. Before I took the car to the dealer, >I inspected both the drain and fill plugs to verify no fluid was >leaking. Put bluntly, the transmission is filled to spec with the >correct fluid. After I gave up arguing with him about trans fluid, he >told me: > >them: you need a new battery >me: I have never had a problem with my battery. >Them: we can=92t get it started in the shop, the charge is weak >Me: I have never had a problem >Them: do you want us to replace it? >Me: no, please do not touch it >Them: then I suggest you bring jumper cables with you when you pick up >your car > >Again, not once have I had a charge problem with my battery, and the >water level was recently checked. His condescending tone when he >suggested I bring my own jumper cables to pick up my car really irked >me, even over and above his suggestions that my trans is lacking fluid.=20 > >I just got the car back from Thompson BMW, transmission in its same >state. Unfortunately, it is not quite as simple as that. The car went in >for 2 other small issues as well =96 a sticking door handle, and a >passenger side window that took a few clicks of the window switch to go >all the way up. These two problems are listed as fixed on my invoice, >and I paid a $50 deductible since my car is now under its CPO warranty. >Now, when I try to put the passenger window down, it stops =BC=94 from = >the >bottom of the track, as though something is stopping it from going all >the way down. My power locks do not work at all. Hitting the central >lock button inside the car does nothing, and my key will only operate >the door it is used on. These problems did not exist before Thompson BMW >touched my car. Also, as noted above, dealer suggested I bring jumper >cables in order to start my vehicle. They quoted $223 (!) to replace my >battery. Car started without hesitation numerous times since pickup. I >am absolutely FURIOUS so far with the service received. I left a >voicemail with the service manager, who is out sick today. As always, >all of your valuable insight/conversation is much appreciated. > >=20 > > > > >************************************************* >Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: >Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com >Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com >BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com >Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > >DIGEST INFORMATION: >http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm >*************************************************
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#4. Actual RPM value. - from Jamie Howton
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 17:09:30 -0600 From: "Jamie Howton" <jhowton@fotofab.com> Subject: Actual RPM value. Is there a way to determine the actual RPM value of an idling OBDI (E36 M3) engine? I want to check the calibration of my tachometer and suspect that the speedometer is mis-calibrated so I can't rely on the 50mph in 5th gear should be xxxx RPM method. Any way to get RPM to display on the on board computer? TIA Jamie Howton 2002 330i 5 Spd Steel Blue Metallic SP 1995 M3 5 Spd Arctic Silver 1979 Porsche 928 5 Speed Opalmetallic
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#5. OT: Insurance Question... - from Reid Conti
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 16:36:04 -0800 From: Reid Conti <reid@conti.net> Subject: OT: Insurance Question... Ah, yet another question from me.. that's 2 in 2 days. This is somewhat OT, but I'm not sure who else to ask about insurance matters, and I need to save a friend from my boneheadedness.. replies should probably be off-list.. thanks! I'll try to make this short. In early December I borrowed a friend's Jeep Grand Cherokee to drive from Santa Clara to San Francisco. While in San Francisco, of course, I managed to back into someone. I'm not really going to dispute that it was my fault. I was on the street, someone in front of me went to back up to take a parallel spot, so I backed up too. I looked in the rearview mirror and then over my shoulder as I backed, but I could not see the VW Cabrio I backed into. The Cabrio had JUST initiated a lane-change, but as we were stuck in traffic they were stopped. The right corner of her car was angled into my lane, so when I backed up my left rear caught her car. I couldn't see out the rear because of the tailgate, the roofline of her car was actually in the lane she was coming from. I would have seen her fine if I had looked in the left side mirror, but (OBM3C) I'm used to just looking behind me in my M3 and seeing who's directly behind me. Not the same in an SUV. The woman was very nice and we exchanged basic info. She noticed the out of state plates (friend's car from NV, I'm from WA). I gave her my phone number, his phone number, MY insurance policy # (I wanted to avoid putting it on his insurance), and I think she has my driver's license # too. She also undoubtedly took down his plate #. Several days later (the 8th of December I think) I emailed her to ask about settling it privately. The damage was limited -- nothing to my friend's car, and on her car the passenger side headlight was pushed in towards the middle and the grille was pushed in a bit. No damage to the bumper cover (although it had lots of rock chips.. =P) or the hood, as far as I could tell -- I doubted it would be more than a busted grille and a busted headlight bracket, if either of those was even broken. She told me she'd get an estimate after the first of the year and send it to me, and we could go from there. At the end of the december, though, her insurance company called him once. The call was dropped, he never understood what they were saying. They didn't call again until a week ago, again didn't connect, and now finally he talked to them. He got the claim #, their phone #, and the name of the woman he spoke with. Basically they're telling him that it has to go against his insurance, that it's $1800, etc. Why she never contacted me directly, I'm not sure. My questions: Why did the insurance company never even bother calling me (since I was driving, wouldn't they want my story, or for me to admit fault, or SOMETHING?) Does the presence of a claim number mean they ARE filing a claim, or does it mean they're just poking around to make sure it CAN be claimed if the private negotiation fails? Is it possible for me to get my insurance company to handle that, or will they outright refuse it since he has coverage? Remember now, I don't think they even HAVE his policy info yet. If she got his license plate number, I know they could figure it out, but I don't think it's gone that far yet (if it had, they would be calling the policy holder (his dad) at home, certainly not the cell phone number I gave). Is it possible for this to be paid in cash? I thought maybe she just inquired with her insurance company to make sure they would be able to take care of it IN CASE I failed to come up with the cash; but since they have a claim # it's starting to sound like it's being handled as a claim and I can't just settle it. But if she HAS filed a claim why are they being so lazy about getting in contact with us and settling the matter? Remember, I don't think they even HAVE his policy info yet. Do I have any grounds whatsoever to bargain/reason with her insurance company? I've seen plenty of bodywork estimates in my day, and even if she needed a whole new headlight, a whole new grille, and to have it painted, I don't see how it could cost more than $800. It sounds like an inflated claim. Maybe the reason they're contacting us is because she decided to have the insurance company do the estimate instead of a body shop.. again, once she's taken this step, I'm not sure if I can settle it or not. If I can't settle it with her, can I pay the insurance company directly? Or do they not do this? :) If I do settle it, how do I make sure she doesn't just take the money and still go thru insurance? thanks for any help you can provide to a poor college student who is rapidly becoming unable to afford his M3 :) I obviously want to do everything I can to avoid burdening my friend with the claim. To make matters worse, he's on a business policy as an employee with his family business that he works at, and there will probably be adverse affects not only to the premiums but his ability to be carried on the policy if this goes thru.. And yes he and his family know and don't care about the accident, but I don't want to burden them... thanks again. - reid
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#6. RE: ripping E36M3 floors (was: Please help me choose a daily driver) - from scott@gelatinous.com
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Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 19:11:46 -0800 From: scott@gelatinous.com Subject: RE: ripping E36M3 floors (was: Please help me choose a daily driver) > -------------------- 2 -------------------- > Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 23:23:08 -0500 > From: Ron Katona <rkatona@cox.net> > Subject: RE: ripping E36M3 floors (was: Please help me choose a daily driver) > > Scott wrote: > > sure, the E36M3 is reinforced there, but that just doesn't cut it in a > > race environment. I personally know of 4 cars (well 5, now including > > mine) that have the cage extended to the front subframe mounts, > ^^^^^ > > I've heard of the front subframe mounts having problems on serious track > cars. I believe the Euro Car reference was to the rear subframe mounts. sorry let me be more specific: the cage is being extended to the front two of the rear subframe mounts. (there are four mounts for the rear subframe). I find it interesting that none of the cars I have surveyed extend the cage to the rear two of the rear subframe mounts. > Anyway, thanks for the data point for those who track their cars heavily > with sticky tires and stiff suspensions. no prob, thanks for indulging my diatribe (my car is in the shop because of this issue right now so I think I have a license to complain for a little while :-) > So are we talking apples and oranges again? Did the rear subframe > actually fail on the M cars, or was it the trailing arm mount and people > are getting the two confused? oh fine.... ;-) I vote "the trailing arm mount much more common and does happen on some street cars. The subframe mounts are probably not an issue on E36 M cars except maybe after 300k+ miles, but there aren't enough sample points to make any judgement with respect to that, and I bet almost all cars will be 'thrown away' before it even starts to become an issue. However B/DMod racers should take note." > P.S. Hey Lee, bet you didn't know you were buying such a POS car! hehehe, I actually also have a '97 M3/4door car, and it is by far the best street car I've ever owned! I wouldn't turn it in for anything, well, except maybe a Euro '97 M3/4door... and when I get old and fat, maybe an M5... Scott ex '89 Mustang GT convert '96 911turbo '97 M3/4 '97 Euro M3 race car '02 Excursion
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#7. Re: Electric Fan Conversion (Long) - from Neil Maller
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 08:38:52 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: Electric Fan Conversion (Long) First, thanks very much for all the posts in response. The back and forth has now become complicated enough with overlapping points from several people that I'm going to make this a collective reply, without specific quote attribution in all cases. It's known from those who have simply removed the main fan that, with the help of the stock aux electric fan, the engine may still cool adequately, may mostly cool adequately, or may not quite cool adequately. Results clearly vary case by case. (I've checked some other forums for additional data.) We also know that the main cooling fan really only serves a useful function at low or no speed. So my decision is that for this car, in order to have a robust cooling system with some performance margin when the main fan is removed, a replacement electric fan *is* required. I've already bought the low-noise/high capacity 16" SPAL unit that others have used successfully. It's possible that this has a higher capacity than is needed. And no, I'm not going to mount it with chewing gum and baling wire, and yes, it'll be powered off a dedicated fused circuit using a relay. > As I understand it the electric fan is an on/off setup, so either the > fan is on or off, you either drawing air into the radiator or not. The > mechanical engine fan is always be working at lower speeds, as the heat > regulates the fan clutch which adjusts the rotation speed of the fan and > will in turn draw some air across the radiator. You can get away with > higher auxilary fan temp switches because of this. I draw the opposite conclusion. Sure, the mechanical fan is always working, even at lower speeds, but never very well because of the low rpm. An electric fan operates whenever the control logic tells it to, and always at full output. It will run continuously or cycle on and off as needed, just like a home furnace, maintaining temperature in a range a few degrees either side of the set point. > Almost ALL electric fan conversions that eliminate the engine fan need > to adjust the water temp switches a bit colder to have the fan work > correctly. However in the case of M3 conversions they seem to use lower temp fan switches because they've first used a lower temp (80C) coolant thermostat. I haven't seen the slightest argument to justify this last. Being an engineering type, I want a good technical reason. There may be one, but I ain't seen it yet! I'll also point out that there's a widespread misconception among car owners that putting in a lower temperature coolant thermostat increases cooling capacity, and that's nonsense. For a sufficiently low ambient it'll cause the engine to run cooler (t'stat cycles around its lower calibration), and with sufficiently high ambient or high cooling demand it'll make no difference (t'stat wide open at all times). > Why would turning on the A/C make the engine overheat or even make it hotter? > Answer: Because the engine has to work harder to move the car AND power the > A/C? Nope. Sure the engine has to work a little harder but not that much. > 2-3 HP (maybe less) at idle. If producing 2-3 more HP causes your engine to > overheat, then you have other problems too. Agreed. It may make a difference, but not enough to be observable. > Remember the auxiliary electric fan comes ON when the A/C is switched on. > This little fan more than compensates for the little extra engine heat. However on the M3 the A/C condenser is mounted immediately in front of the radiator. Turning on the A/C has the effect of raising the temperature of cooling air to the radiator. > I have observations to prove it. My commuter car... But that's on another car, which may not have the save cooling layout. > So, if you are stuck in traffic and water temperature is rising, turn on the > A/C. The auxiliary electric fan will turn on. No, better NOT to turn the A/C on, since the stock aux fan will eventually kick in anyway, triggered by high coolant temp. > And if you really want to lower engine temperature, turn the cabin temperature > to full hot. Now you are drawing a little heat from the engine (and making it > unbearable inside the cabin). And that's why I want the electric fan! > Neil! You are a mechanic engineer. Wash your mouth out! I'm an electrical guy. >Have you forgotten all of your thermodynamics? Damn right I have, but thanks for the info! > I'm not sure where you guys are coming up with this 88C thermostat, let alone > the 80C some guys are using. I got my parts from Bimmer Parts aka Zygmunt > like many others. However, I was shipped a 92C thermostat - a HOTTER > thermostat. I tore my car apart and removed the stock thermostat. It was > clearly marked 88C. I called Zygmunt to complain. I was told that the 92C > thermostat has superseded the 88C thermostat which is no longer available. Higher temperatures are typically beneficial for emissions. At some point BMW bumped the M3 thermostat up from 88C to 92C, apparently for that reason. I can't find it now, but somebody was wondering how one would even find an 80C thermostat, and thought it might be some $$$$ racing part. In fact this calibration was used on some older BMW models, both Euro and US, and is physically compatible. So now, back to the basics. Failing any reason to switch to an 80C coolant thermostat, I plan to stick with the stock 88/92C (whichever turns out to be in there). However Bob Kobayashi pointed out a fault in my original fan switch analysis. I had neglected to consider the full effect of the fact that this switch is located on the outlet (cooler) side of the radiator. Coolant will enter the radiator at a minimum 88/92C (stock thermostat opens), and exit at some lower temperature that depends on conditions. It is the exit temp that the fan switch reads. The stock fan switch has two contacts: 99C and 91C. (The alternative 318i switch has 88C and 80C.) My original plan was to use the 99C contact, but this now seems too high, since the fan would only kick in both if coolant inlet temp was in excess of 99C and little or no radiator cooling was happening. I think that might be insufficiently aggressive. So I now propose to use the 91C contact, which will make the SPAL fan run more often. Because I'm not changing the switch, the stock aux A/C fan will still run exactly the same as before (as a function both of coolant temperature and A/C system pressure). If it should turn out that the SPAL fan needs to run more often than that, I could either fit the 80/88C 318i fan switch, which would also affect the aux fan, or use a Derale variable fan switch that would be independent. Lowell adds: > I know your "simple" mod will take two weeks labor and look > like a million bucks. Thanks! So far it's taking the typical path: planning time an order of magnitude greater than execution time. I may add that if I can't get the *#$@!! hood latch to open then NONE of this is going to happen! Neil 96 M3
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#8. Horrible Vendor Alert - from Jason Leung
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:49:27 -0800 From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> Subject: Horrible Vendor Alert Please do not patronize importcarparts.com. You may regret it. I ordered a Bosch Fuel pressure regulator from Importcarparts.com. I ordered by Bosch part number. When I received the part, I discovered that they had shipped me a DIFFERENT Bosch part. Import car parts told me that the part they shipped me superceded the part number that I ordered. I consulted the Bosch book and this was simply not true. Then I called Bosch HQ in the States and talked to their tech advisors....and BOSCH themselves told me that the two part numbers are NOT equivalent..... I called BOSCH HQ again the next day ... and they told me the same thing .... that the parts do not match. When I called import car parts again they basically said, "Too bad, this is what we have on file as a replacement." I said "well you should have asked me if I want a different part before shipping it to me." The guy then claimed that "Well that's what we have on file....that's your part" Then I told him even BOSCH said it was different. Then when I told them I wanted to return the part they told me I would have to pay a restocking fee. When I told them I didn't think I should be subject to the restocking fee, they yelled at me over the phone, calling me an "IGNORANT F**K ... Its your mistake you PIECE OF SH**"". Then I hung up. I'm sorry but this place just plain stinks. Never again. I filed a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. Jason
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#9. RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert - from Carey Probst
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:10:13 -0500 From: "Carey Probst" <hcprobst@alum.mit.edu> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert Jason, Hopefully you used a Visa or MasterCard for the part. If you did, contact your bank directly and reject the charge to the card and explain why. They should bounce the charge back to the vendor. Just one of the reasons I NEVER use a debit card or Paypal for online purchases unless I know the vendor well. Carey Probst, '99 M3/2, BMW CCA Patroon and Genesee Valley Chapters JC CAIed and Sharked, Stressed, Schrothed, Gauged, Hitched, X-Braced A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -----Original Message----- From: Jason Leung [mailto:jhleung@earthlink.net] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 1:54 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:49:27 -0800 From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> Subject: Horrible Vendor Alert Please do not patronize importcarparts.com. You may regret it. I ordered a Bosch Fuel pressure regulator from Importcarparts.com. I ordered by Bosch part number. When I received the part, I discovered that they had shipped me a DIFFERENT Bosch part. Import car parts told me that the part they shipped me superceded the part number that I ordered. I consulted the Bosch book and this was simply not true. Then I called Bosch HQ in the States and talked to their tech advisors....and BOSCH themselves told me that the two part numbers are NOT equivalent..... I called BOSCH HQ again the next day ... and they told me the same thing .... that the parts do not match. When I called import car parts again they basically said, "Too bad, this is what we have on file as a replacement." I said "well you should have asked me if I want a different part before shipping it to me." The guy then claimed that "Well that's what we have on file....that's your part" Then I told him even BOSCH said it was different. Then when I told them I wanted to return the part they told me I would have to pay a restocking fee. When I told them I didn't think I should be subject to the restocking fee, they yelled at me over the phone, calling me an "IGNORANT F**K ... Its your mistake you PIECE OF SH**"". Then I hung up. I'm sorry but this place just plain stinks. Never again. I filed a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. Jason ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#10. RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert - from Dames, Mark
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 11:20:52 -0800 From: "Dames, Mark" <Mark.Dames@PDO.Co.Santa-Clara.CA.US> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert call your credit card company and tell them to reverse the charge, they charged you for an unauthorized sale, you didn't buy that product. It's exactly the same thing as if they decided to unilaterally ship/charge you for a windshield instead of the desired fuel pump. Then call importcarparts, inform them the charges are reversed and tell them the pump is on your front porch, they can pick it up anytime. mark. -----Original Message----- From: Jason Leung [mailto:jhleung@earthlink.net] Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 10:54 AM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:49:27 -0800 From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> Subject: Horrible Vendor Alert Please do not patronize importcarparts.com. You may regret it. I ordered a Bosch Fuel pressure regulator from Importcarparts.com. I ordered by Bosch part number. When I received the part, I discovered that they had shipped me a DIFFERENT Bosch part. Import car parts told me that the part they shipped me superceded the part number that I ordered. I consulted the Bosch book and this was simply not true. Then I called Bosch HQ in the States and talked to their tech advisors....and BOSCH themselves told me that the two part numbers are NOT equivalent..... I called BOSCH HQ again the next day ... and they told me the same thing .... that the parts do not match. When I called import car parts again they basically said, "Too bad, this is what we have on file as a replacement." I said "well you should have asked me if I want a different part before shipping it to me." The guy then claimed that "Well that's what we have on file....that's your part" Then I told him even BOSCH said it was different. Then when I told them I wanted to return the part they told me I would have to pay a restocking fee. When I told them I didn't think I should be subject to the restocking fee, they yelled at me over the phone, calling me an "IGNORANT F**K ... Its your mistake you PIECE OF SH**"". Then I hung up. I'm sorry but this place just plain stinks. Never again. I filed a complaint with the Better Business Bureau. Jason ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#11. Re: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert - from matthew c. mead
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:21:28 -0500 From: "matthew c. mead" <mmead-bmw@goof.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert Send a letter to your bank. You lose certain legal rights by disputing the charge via phone instead of in writing. -matt On Thu, Jan 30, 2003 at 01:13:52PM -0600, Carey Probst wrote: > Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 14:10:13 -0500 > From: "Carey Probst" <hcprobst@alum.mit.edu> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert > > Jason, > > Hopefully you used a Visa or MasterCard for the part. > > If you did, contact your bank directly and reject the charge to the card and > explain why. They should bounce the charge back to the vendor. > > Just one of the reasons I NEVER use a debit card or Paypal for online > purchases unless I know the vendor well. > > Carey Probst, '99 M3/2, BMW CCA Patroon and Genesee Valley Chapters > JC CAIed and Sharked, Stressed, Schrothed, Gauged, Hitched, X-Braced > > A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, > the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Jason Leung [mailto:jhleung@earthlink.net] > Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 1:54 PM > To: E36M3 > Subject: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert > > > Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:49:27 -0800 > From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> > Subject: Horrible Vendor Alert > > Please do not patronize importcarparts.com. You may regret it. > > I ordered a Bosch Fuel pressure regulator from Importcarparts.com. I > ordered by Bosch part number. When I received the part, I discovered that > they had shipped me a DIFFERENT Bosch part. Import car parts told me that > the part they shipped me superceded the part number that I ordered. I > consulted the Bosch book and this was simply not true. Then I called Bosch > HQ in the States and talked to their tech advisors....and BOSCH themselves > told me that the two part numbers are NOT equivalent..... I called BOSCH > HQ again the next day ... and they told me the same thing .... that the > parts do not match. > > When I called import car parts again they basically said, "Too bad, this is > what we have on file as a replacement." I said "well you should have asked > me if I want a different part before shipping it to me." > > The guy then claimed that "Well that's what we have on file....that's your > part" > > Then I told him even BOSCH said it was different. > > Then when I told them I wanted to return the part they told me I would have > to pay a restocking fee. When I told them I didn't think I should be > subject to the restocking fee, they yelled at me over the phone, calling me > an "IGNORANT F**K ... Its your mistake you PIECE OF SH**"". > > Then I hung up. > > I'm sorry but this place just plain stinks. Never again. I filed a > complaint with the Better Business Bureau. > > Jason > > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > -- matthew c. mead 97 Dakar M3/4 97 White GS-R/4 92 Black Miata 87 White Saab 900S http://www.goof.com/~mmead/
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#12. RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert - from Jason Leung
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Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 11:29:38 -0800 From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert Thanks Mark for the advice. Yes, I reversed the charges yesterday; now I'm just putting a warning out there. I'm usually a very fair person. I try to give everybody the benefit of the doubt. I try to treat everyone with the same respect that I'd like to be treated with.... But this singularly has to be the worst customer service I've ever received. By Far. Jason At 11:20 AM 1/30/2003, Dames, Mark wrote: >call your credit card company and tell them to reverse the charge, they >charged you for an unauthorized sale, you didn't buy that product. It's >exactly the same thing as if they decided to unilaterally ship/charge you >for a windshield instead of the desired fuel pump. >Then call importcarparts, inform them the charges are reversed and tell them >the pump is on your front porch, they can pick it up anytime. > >mark. > >-----Original Message----- >From: Jason Leung [mailto:jhleung@earthlink.net] >Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2003 10:54 AM >To: E36M3 >Subject: [E36M3] Horrible Vendor Alert > > >Date: Thu, 30 Jan 2003 10:49:27 -0800 >From: Jason Leung <jhleung@earthlink.net> >Subject: Horrible Vendor Alert > >Please do not patronize importcarparts.com. You may regret it. > >I ordered a Bosch Fuel pressure regulator from Importcarparts.com. I >ordered by Bosch part number. When I received the part, I discovered that >they had shipped me a DIFFERENT Bosch part. Import car parts told me that >the part they shipped me superceded the part number that I ordered. I >consulted the Bosch book and this was simply not true. Then I called Bosch >HQ in the States and talked to their tech advisors....and BOSCH themselves >told me that the two part numbers are NOT equivalent..... I called BOSCH >HQ again the next day ... and they told me the same thing .... that the >parts do not match. > >When I called import car parts again they basically said, "Too bad, this is >what we have on file as a replacement." I said "well you should have asked >me if I want a different part before shipping it to me." > >The guy then claimed that "Well that's what we have on file....that's your >part" > >Then I told him even BOSCH said it was different. > >Then when I told them I wanted to return the part they told me I would have >to pay a restocking fee. When I told them I didn't think I should be >subject to the restocking fee, they yelled at me over the phone, calling me >an "IGNORANT F**K ... Its your mistake you PIECE OF SH**"". > >Then I hung up. > >I'm sorry but this place just plain stinks. Never again. I filed a >complaint with the Better Business Bureau. > >Jason > > > > >************************************************* >Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: >Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com >Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com >BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com >Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > >DIGEST INFORMATION: >http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm >*************************************************