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#1. Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? - from LoweSeaton@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 13:25:26 EDT From: LoweSeaton@aol.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? rbuchals@hotmail.com writes: > On a related note, are there any mechanical engineering types on this list > who know what engineering considerations are made when recommending a motor > > oil for an engine? Ron, This is easy to answer. No mechanical engineering degree required - just an economics degree. [Although I have multiple degrees in civil/structural engineering.] BMW's recommended oil weight is based totally on increasing fleet gas mileage. BMW like all car manufacturers has to meet EPA CAFE fuel economy requirements. The current standard is 27.5 mpg. BMW is well below this. Last figure I could find had BMW at about 25 mpg. The car manufacturer pays a fine if the fleet average is below 27.5 mpg. The fine is $5.50 per 0.1 mpg times the number of cars sold. So that works out to $137.50 per car. How many cars does BMW sell in the US? 400,000?? Then that is $55 million. I see for Model Year 2000 BMW paid $27.5 million. I know BMW is selling a lot more cars now than 3 years ago so the fine has increased. There is no doubt that thinner oils slightly increase gas mileage. I was curious one summer and ran straight 60W oil in my M3. I immediately noticed about 1 mpg drop in gas mileage. Remember we are talking about BMW here. These are the same guys that recommend 15,000-20,000 mile oil changes based upon the silly service indicator lights. BMW is cheap for sure. By using 5W-30 synthetic oil, BMW can get away with recommending the long oil changes and the lighter weight oil increases gas mileage. By the way, BMW is not the only car maker playing this game. All car makers are reducing the recommended oil weight. Have you noticed 5W-20 oil on the shelf? I see newer cars are recommending 5W-20 now. Lowell Seaton '95 M3 - 4 qt Valvoline 20W-50 DuraBlend and 3 qt Valvoline Racing 50W changed every 4,000 miles Dallas, Texas
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#2. Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from DocWyte
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:39:51 -0700 (PDT) From: DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? Even with the proper tools, I wouldn't install the cams. From what I've gathered, you really need to know what you're doing to properly install these and get the vanos timed properly. Definately not for the faint of heart and/or the ignorant (like me!). -josh --- Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> wrote: > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:12:21 -0700 (PDT) > From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a > 24lb injector buy? > > Well, I have said tools needed to install cams....so > you can trim off $500 :) > > Chester > > --- DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> wrote: > > Schrick cam package $1600 > > (assuming you already have intake/hfm) > > Install of said cams $500 > > TOTAL $2100 > > > > Yep, might as well pony up the remaining $1700 for > the > > cam package cause it's so cheap. > > > ===== > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our > sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > ===== __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more http://tax.yahoo.com
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#3. Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from Chester Wong
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 10:46:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? Heh...there are a few things you have to make sure of...like making sure the tranny is out of gear so that you don't move the engine at all once you locate TDC (stock cars have a pin location in the flywheel, but for those of us with LTW flywheels) and making sure the 1st and 6th cylinder cam lobes don't come anywhere near the hydraulic lifter when removing/installing cams (that wouldn't be pretty for the valves). Other than that, it's cake....VANOS schmaNOS +) Just use some assembly grease...wish I had remembered :) Chester --- DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> wrote: > Even with the proper tools, I wouldn't install the > cams. From what I've gathered, you really need to > know what you're doing to properly install these and > get the vanos timed properly. Definately not for the > faint of heart and/or the ignorant (like me!). =====
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#4. Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from Dorffer, Rich
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:23:49 -0400 From: "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> Subject: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? > Track pipe (ie, mid pipe getting rid of the cats) > Alex, not a cat back exhaust. Also, I think most of us know this is illegal for the street but I figured it should be stated for anyone that is considering this option and isn't aware. Regards, Rich - tries to obey the law, my right foot occasionally disagrees...
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#5. Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? - from Ron Buchalski
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Date: Wed, 09 Apr 2003 14:24:50 -0400 From: "Ron Buchalski" <rbuchals@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? Actually, Lowell, I wasn't looking for a reason why BMW changed their recommendation. I wanted to know the mechanical analysis that an ME conducts in order to determine which oil provides the best lubricating properties based on the engine, expected use, environmental factors, etc. Ron Buchalski BMWCCA #76387 1995 E36 M3 1993 E34 525iT 1999 Mazda Miata >From: LoweSeaton@aol.com >To: rbuchals@hotmail.com, e36m3@bmw-m.net >Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? >Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 13:25:26 EDT > >rbuchals@hotmail.com writes: > > > On a related note, are there any mechanical engineering types on this >list > > who know what engineering considerations are made when recommending a >motor > > > > oil for an engine? > >Ron, > >This is easy to answer. No mechanical engineering degree required - just >an >economics degree. [Although I have multiple degrees in civil/structural >engineering.] _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
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#6. Re: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from mike
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:25:26 -0400 From: "mike" <95m3ltw@charter.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? Where are you getting your numbers? from a track pipe or crack pipe? 20hp and 30ftlbs of torque? If you find a track pipe that will do that, start selling them as everybody elses doenst, according to the dynos in the real world, not AA dynos in fantasy land. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "DocWyte" <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 10:33 AM Subject: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 07:28:08 -0700 (PDT) > From: DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? > > Yes, he really told me that. > > I have a euro hfm, jc intake and chip. I'll be adding > a track pipe soon. > > Let's put it this way. 24 lb injectors are needed for > cams, which ass 10 whp and 10 wft lbs of torque across > the band. A track pipe adds twice that amount in hp > and practically three times that amount in torque to > the wheels across the band. (if the dyno's are > believable) > > I was worried that the stock 17.5lb injectors wouldn't > be able to keep up and Josh@Eurosport confirmed it. > > -josh > > --- "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> wrote: > > > On the advice of Josh@Eurosport I'm going to pick > > a > > > set of these up. He thinks I'll be pushing my > > stock > > > 17.5lb injectors pretty close to the limit with my > > > next mod and I'd rather have a little more > > injector > > > headroom. > > > > Really, Josh told you that? What set-up do you have? > > Are you sure Josh told you that? Are you getting a > > software change too? Josh really told you that huh? > > > > Later, > > > > Rich > > > ===== > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more > http://tax.yahoo.com > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > >
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#7. Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from Ahmad Lutfeali
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:18:33 -0400 From: "Ahmad Lutfeali" <m3_racer99@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] RE: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? Just as another data point, I was able to max out the 21.5lb injectors ('96-99) around 240-245rwhp on a cold day Steve, How are you getting 240-245RWHP on your 96+? I am very interested. Ahmad Lutfeali 98 M3/2 Atlanta
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#8. Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? - from Chester Wong
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 11:47:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Chester Wong <chester_p_wong@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? I think Lowell's point was replying to list members saying that "BMW says to use 10W30 so why use anything else." I think he is also saying that even if an ME did analysis and found the 15W40 or 15W50 to be best, that the penny pinchers would say not to use that and instead go with 10W30... Chester --- Ron Buchalski <rbuchals@hotmail.com> wrote: > Actually, Lowell, I wasn't looking for a reason why BMW changed their > recommendation. I wanted to know the mechanical analysis that an ME > conducts in order to determine which oil provides the best lubricating > properties based on the engine, expected use, environmental factors, etc. = =====
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#9. Re: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? - from DocWyte
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 11:49:35 -0700 (PDT) From: DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector buy? Mike, Geuss you missed this part "(if the dyno's are believable)" of my post below. Even if the AA dyno is off by 50%, the track pipe still adds as much power as a set of schrick cams, which require bigger injectors. As to the veracity of the AA dyno, my friend has their supercharger system on his M coupe. They dynoed it on their dyno, then he redynoed it on a dynojet here. Geuss what? The numbers were the same. Hmmm... Wonder who's on the crack pipe now? -josh --- mike <95m3ltw@charter.net> wrote: > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:25:26 -0400 > From: "mike" <95m3ltw@charter.net> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a > 24lb injector buy? > > Where are you getting your numbers? from a track > pipe or crack pipe? > > 20hp and 30ftlbs of torque? > > If you find a track pipe that will do that, start > selling them as everybody > elses doenst, according to the dynos in the real > world, not AA dynos in > fantasy land. > > Mike > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "DocWyte" <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> > To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> > Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2003 10:33 AM > Subject: [E36M3] Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb > injector buy? > > > > Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 07:28:08 -0700 (PDT) > > From: DocWyte <josh_wyte@yahoo.com> > > Subject: Re: Who wants to go in on a 24lb injector > buy? > > > > Yes, he really told me that. > > > > I have a euro hfm, jc intake and chip. I'll be > adding > > a track pipe soon. > > > > Let's put it this way. 24 lb injectors are needed > for > > cams, which ass 10 whp and 10 wft lbs of torque > across > > the band. A track pipe adds twice that amount in > hp > > and practically three times that amount in torque > to > > the wheels across the band. (if the dyno's are > > believable) > > > > I was worried that the stock 17.5lb injectors > wouldn't > > be able to keep up and Josh@Eurosport confirmed > it. > > > > -josh > > > > --- "Dorffer, Rich" <RDORFFER@CleIndians.com> > wrote: > > > > On the advice of Josh@Eurosport I'm going to > pick > > > a > > > > set of these up. He thinks I'll be pushing my > > > stock > > > > 17.5lb injectors pretty close to the limit > with my > > > > next mod and I'd rather have a little more > > > injector > > > > headroom. > > > > > > Really, Josh told you that? What set-up do you > have? > > > Are you sure Josh told you that? Are you getting > a > > > software change too? Josh really told you that > huh? > > > > > > Later, > > > > > > Rich > > > > > > ===== > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, > forms, and more > > http://tax.yahoo.com > > > > > > ************************************************* > > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our > sponsors: > > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > > ************************************************* > > > > > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our > sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > ===== __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - File online, calculators, forms, and more http://tax.yahoo.com
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#10. Re: [E36M3] 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? - from ChuckBrazeau@aol.com
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Date: Wed, 9 Apr 2003 14:51:35 EDT From: ChuckBrazeau@aol.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] 15W50 Mobil 1 for summer: anyone use this? Just curious what everyones thoughts are on Mobil 1's 0W40 oil that is their "European Car Formula"? Chuck Brazeau '95 BMW M3 - Violet on Black SCCA Solo2 - Street Modified #95 <A HREF="http://www.brazeauracing.com/">http://www.brazeauracing.com/</A>