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#1. RE: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size wheels/tires - from Dames, Mark
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 10:58:56 -0700 From: "Dames, Mark" <Mark.Dames@PDO.Co.Santa-Clara.CA.US> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size wheels/tires After some research I determined (IMO) that the best street/strip compromise was 1)stay with stock wheels because they fit better as far as offset goes, no need for spacers. 2)equalize the rim and tire size all around for neutral/less understeer handling 3)As between staying with stock/rear 245/40/17 and 8.5" rims OR going down to 235/40/17 and 8" rims, it's better to stay big (absent availability of R-compound track tire concerns) 4)A second set of M3 8.5in rims and Pilot Sports in a 245/40/17 will fit in the front, SO3's in the same size will not because the shoulder of the tire is too square and will rub. So you just need to get your hands on a second set of 8.5" M3 (rear rims), which if used, will save you over the cost of buying 4 new rims in a smaller size. I use Pilots, they have good durability, the handling I find very good and predictable when the inflation is right. Haven't done SO3's. As for price, dunno, check www.tirerack.com Now if you're thinking of a second set of wheels for dedicated track use, then you have tire size availability issues that may require you to think smaller. This however is not recommended for a beginner (I'd say less than 10 schools). It messes up your learning curve/will artificially inflate your handling and speed envelope without mastery of necessary correction and smoothness skills. Some people never go to R-Compounds becaue the tire doesn't communicate to you when its starting to loose traction, they just go. And way before R-compounds, I'd look at suspension upgrades to get the most out of your car and your own skill developement. mark. -----Original Message----- From: Paul Smith [mailto:pauls@ontario.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 20, 2003 8:57 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size wheels/tires Date: Wed, 20 Aug 2003 22:51:41 -0500 From: Paul Smith <pauls@ontario.com> Subject: Staggered vs same size wheels/tires I am looking into getting another set of wheels/tires for the DE/street. I have a 98 M3/4. IS there much difference going to the same size 235/40/17 for a novice? I have only had one school and want to learn the best way. Any comments are extremely appreciated. Also, Pilots and the SO3's seem to be the choice. If you had 100 - 125 per tire, what is the best for that money? TIA Paul Smith 98 M3/4/5 ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#2. RE: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size wheels/tires - from David Ngo
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 11:35:59 -0700 (PDT) From: David Ngo <rudngo@yahoo.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size wheels/tires My 245/40-17 S-O3s fit quite nicely in front on stock 8.5" rims (as did the previous S-O2s.) However, my BFG KDs did not fit without a spacer. Dave --- "Dames, Mark" <Mark.Dames@PDO.Co.Santa-Clara.CA.US> wrote: > Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 10:58:56 -0700 > From: "Dames, Mark" > <Mark.Dames@PDO.Co.Santa-Clara.CA.US> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Staggered vs same size > wheels/tires > 4)A second set of M3 8.5in rims and Pilot Sports in > a 245/40/17 will fit in > the front, SO3's in the same size will not because > the shoulder of the tire > is too square and will rub. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com
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#3. Rear Wheel Bearing R&R - from Steve Klein
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 12:48:35 -0700 From: Steve Klein <klein@robinsonad.com> Subject: Rear Wheel Bearing R&R Hi, Group- Any write-ups or pointers (other than Bentley) for doing the rear wheel bearings on a '95? It says to remove the drive axle, but in the drive axle section, it says you don't need to remove it just to replace the bearing. Huh? Is there a special tool or technique for pressing the new bearing into the housing? Any caveats or BTDT's? Thanks in advance, Steve
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#4. spark plugs? - from Marshall Lytle
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 18:12:48 -0400 From: "Marshall Lytle" <mblytle@compuserve.com> Subject: spark plugs? anyone happen to know what the correct spark plug for a 97 m3 is? -the owners manual says "f7 ldcr" bosch -Bentley says to check with dealer because the number gets superceded frequently -i ordered some from alloembmw.com and got "fgr 8 kqe" bosch plugs. started to do inspection 2 tonight and want to confirm the plugs i got from alloembmw are correct before i put them in. thanks! marshall
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#5. Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack - from daanesh chanduwadia
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 14:18:42 -0400 From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> Subject: Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack Tucker, I never heard anyone comment on this either, which is why I had to find out the hard way. The short of it is different tires have different responses or gain as you move away from center. Unidirectionals like the Dunlop 9000 and the Pilot Sport are slower in response and tend to be less linear as you increase the amount of lock. The gain of the car's steering system (rack ratio, caster, etc) combines with this tire gain to give the overall response, and when you combine the variable rack (slow around center and progressively quicker as you approach lock) with the variable nature of a unidirectional the results are - well let's just say that they're different than intended (some will no doubt swear their 95 is better without the MXX3s). The MXX3s were the only tire 3.0 M3s came on. Later, the MXX3 was phased out and the Pilot Sport took its place. The 3.2 car had a quicker rack around center so it was less of a problem, yet the first time I drove on Pilot Sports, I thought - "something's strange with the steering." The term unidirectional is perhaps too vague: the M5 steering feels sharper on the Dunlop 8080s than it does on Pilot Sports and you'll see that while the 8080 *is* a unidirectional, the blocks are arranged in rows, unlike the Pilot Sport which has the tread sweeping outward - the tire doesn't 'know where straight-ahead is' which i think is commonly referred to as self aligning torque. If you haven't driven your car on MXX3s or similar, try it. Sure you'll give up hydro resistance and the limit will be breached more suddenly but you'll feel more connected to what's happening at the contact patches, which for me is one of the principle joys of driving. I should add that it does depend on your priorities and how much you like a tire with lots of slip angle. I value steering precision and linearity above almost all else, which means to say I'm willing to give up some grip - especially in the wet - to get it. Which is why I'm on MXX3s again and will be on P Zero Neros or the new Pilot Sport next. | daaneshGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com
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#6. RE: OBC Failure when using HIDs? - from Chris Conner
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 19:20:42 -0400 From: "Chris Conner" <chris@digital7.com> Subject: RE: OBC Failure when using HIDs? The HIDs throw a 'Low Beam Failure' occasionally, or all the time because their current draw is much less than a standard halogen bulb. I do not see any possible way that HIDs can kill your OBC. Chris -------------------- 10 -------------------- Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 19:40:16 -0700 From: Reid Conti <reid@conti.net> Subject: OBC Failure when using HIDs? I have a friend who just bought an E36 M3 and is having it shipped to him.. It has HIDs, and supposedly the OBC does not work. He is convinced from reading Jim Powell's articles http://www.apexcone.com/JimPowellHomepage/Lighting/HIDs/HID.html That Update II discusses complete OBD failure when using certain HID systems, whereas I argue that, based on the wording and lack of any reports to the contrary, the only 'failure' people experience with their OBC and HIDs is that of the "check control" system, reporting a low beam failure. comments? Anybody had HIDs kill their OBC? - reid
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#7. Re: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack - from Michael Lawrence
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 22:15:03 -0400 From: "Michael Lawrence" <95m3ltw@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack Thats some deep stuff. Man, I thought I was one of the few that truly loved the steering in the 95 M3. I would add that out of all the tires I have tracked, the MXX3s also performed like no other. Great feedback, grip and control at the limit. The only other tire that came close on all accounts were the P7000, not the P7000 SS. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 6:43 PM Subject: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack > Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 14:18:42 -0400 > From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> > Subject: Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack > > Tucker, > I never heard anyone comment on this either, which is why I had to find out the hard way. > The short of it is different tires have different responses or gain as you move away from center. Unidirectionals like the Dunlop 9000 and the Pilot Sport are slower in response and tend to be less linear as you increase the amount of lock. > The gain of the car's steering system (rack ratio, caster, etc) combines with this tire gain to give the overall response, and when you combine the variable rack (slow around center and progressively quicker as you approach lock) with the variable nature of a unidirectional the results are - well let's just say that they're different than intended (some will no doubt swear their 95 is better without the MXX3s). > The MXX3s were the only tire 3.0 M3s came on. Later, the MXX3 was phased out and the Pilot Sport took its place. The 3.2 car had a quicker rack around center so it was less of a problem, yet the first time I drove on Pilot Sports, I thought - "something's strange with the steering." > The term unidirectional is perhaps too vague: the M5 steering feels sharper on the Dunlop 8080s than it does on Pilot Sports and you'll see that while the 8080 *is* a unidirectional, the blocks are arranged in rows, unlike the Pilot Sport which has the tread sweeping outward - the tire doesn't 'know where straight-ahead is' which i think is commonly referred to as self aligning torque. > If you haven't driven your car on MXX3s or similar, try it. Sure you'll give up hydro resistance and the limit will be breached more suddenly but you'll feel more connected to what's happening at the contact patches, which for me is one of the principle joys of driving. > I should add that it does depend on your priorities and how much you like a tire with lots of slip angle. I value steering precision and linearity above almost all else, which means to say I'm willing to give up some grip - especially in the wet - to get it. > Which is why I'm on MXX3s again and will be on P Zero Neros or the new Pilot Sport next. > | daaneshGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > >
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#8. Re: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack - from Scott M
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Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 22:20:00 -0700 From: Scott M <smlists@pacbell.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack Actually, the P7000 SS are not so bad. I picked up a set of 8.5" forged wheels all around and they had a set of almost brand new P7000 SS on them in 235/255 sizes. I figured I would run them for awhile until I couldn't stand it anymore, but was surprised to find them quite nice. They have a very good amount of both wet and dry grip, good feedback and with 15K miles on them so far seem to be wearing pretty good too. I want to try something else next time around, but I've been quite impressed with the tire. I have done one track session with them at LSIR and they did very well on the track too letting me know just how far I could push it - I was driving fairly conservatively but still ended up running some mid 1:50's towards the end of the day, and it that was my first time tracking the car (not first time on the track or at LSIR, just first time in the M3). Car is completely bone stock and has not even had a performance alignment. Shows what great cars these things are.... Scott '97 M3/4 on 8/22/03 7:33 PM, Michael Lawrence at 95m3ltw@comcast.net wrote: > Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 22:15:03 -0400 > From: "Michael Lawrence" <95m3ltw@comcast.net> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack > > Thats some deep stuff. Man, I thought I was one of the few that truly > loved the steering in the 95 M3. I would add that out of all the tires I > have tracked, the MXX3s also performed like no other. Great feedback, grip > and control at the limit. The only other tire that came close on all > accounts were the P7000, not the P7000 SS. > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> > To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2003 6:43 PM > Subject: [E36M3] Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack > > >> Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2003 14:18:42 -0400 >> From: "daanesh chanduwadia" <daanesh@hotmail.com> >> Subject: Re: MXX3 replacements/variable rack >> >> Tucker, >> I never heard anyone comment on this either, which is why I had to find > out the hard way. >> The short of it is different tires have different responses or gain as you > move away from center. Unidirectionals like the Dunlop 9000 and the Pilot > Sport are slower in response and tend to be less linear as you increase the > amount of lock. >> The gain of the car's steering system (rack ratio, caster, etc) combines > with this tire gain to give the overall response, and when you combine the > variable rack (slow around center and progressively quicker as you approach > lock) with the variable nature of a unidirectional the results are - well > let's just say that they're different than intended (some will no doubt > swear their 95 is better without the MXX3s). >> The MXX3s were the only tire 3.0 M3s came on. Later, the MXX3 was phased > out and the Pilot Sport took its place. The 3.2 car had a quicker rack > around center so it was less of a problem, yet the first time I drove on > Pilot Sports, I thought - "something's strange with the steering." >> The term unidirectional is perhaps too vague: the M5 steering feels > sharper on the Dunlop 8080s than it does on Pilot Sports and you'll see that > while the 8080 *is* a unidirectional, the blocks are arranged in rows, > unlike the Pilot Sport which has the tread sweeping outward - the tire > doesn't 'know where straight-ahead is' which i think is commonly referred to > as self aligning torque. >> If you haven't driven your car on MXX3s or similar, try it. Sure you'll > give up hydro resistance and the limit will be breached more suddenly but > you'll feel more connected to what's happening at the contact patches, which > for me is one of the principle joys of driving. >> I should add that it does depend on your priorities and how much you like > a tire with lots of slip angle. I value steering precision and linearity > above almost all else, which means to say I'm willing to give up some grip - > especially in the wet - to get it. >> Which is why I'm on MXX3s again and will be on P Zero Neros or the new > Pilot Sport next. >> | daaneshGet more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : > http://explorer.msn.com >> >> >> ************************************************* >> Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: >> Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com >> Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com >> BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com >> Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com >> Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com >> >> DIGEST INFORMATION: >> http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm >> ************************************************* >> >> > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > Taylor Autosport http://www.taylorautosport.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > BMW M3 Specialties http://www.jt-designs.com > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* >
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#9. Re: [E36M3] spark plugs? - from Andrej Dolenc
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Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2003 08:54:05 -0400 From: Andrej Dolenc <adolenc@erols.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] spark plugs? > anyone happen to know what the correct spark plug for a 97 m3 is? > -the owners manual says "f7 ldcr" bosch > -Bentley says to check with dealer because the number gets superceded > frequently > -i ordered some from alloembmw.com and got "fgr 8 kqe" bosch plugs. > started to do inspection 2 tonight and want to confirm the plugs i got from > alloembmw are correct before i put them in. You're good to go. When I went to replace my plugs I simply pulled one out and bought 6 of those. It was Bosch fgr8kqc, since replaced by the fgr8kqe plug (according to some recent postings on this list). Andrej '97 M3 ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ################################################################# ##### ##### ##### ################################################################# ################################################################# #################################################################
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#10. Torque specs on Konis - from Shelhart2@aol.com
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Date: Sat, 23 Aug 2003 16:46:45 EDT From: Shelhart2@aol.com Subject: Torque specs on Konis After installing the new Konis and springs a few months back I've been getting a fair amount of noise (like bushings are worn) over small bumps / rough roads. This job was a DIY that I'm not in a hurry to do again.... Is it possible that I didn't properly torque the top nut and I'm getting a bit of "slack" that is causing the noise? What is the proper torque for the top nut? The control arm bushings / tie rod look fine with visual inspection. Thoughts? The car has 78k miles and has only seen one autoX. TIA. Shel Hart 1998 M3