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#1. Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? - from Aleks Tan
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 11:39:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Aleks Tan <aleks.tan@sbcglobal.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? I have both an E46 M3 (convertible with SMG so take it for what it's worth) and a 95 E36 M3. While I love my E46 when it's time to go for a "fun" drive I'll grab for the E36 keys. That being said, the E46 is an EXTREMELY capable machine and I can describe driving it as if you're in a video game - is does everything you want it to do and it goes wherever you point it, but it lacks feel and the "excitement" I get from the E36. With the driver aids and all it just makes it seem like the car does lots of the driving for you as long as I do my part and steer it in the right direction. I cannot argue that I'm probably faster in the mountains with the E46 but on the autox course I'm much quicker (and have more fun) with the E36. SMG is a great tool in the backroads and no doubt shifts faster but it also takes away the "driver's element" of snapping of a good clean shift. If I could only have ONE I'd choose the E46 because it is newer, nicer, more powerful and the limits are just that much higher (stock for stock) but I don't plan on giving up my E36 either. Once I get the suspension and brakes done on the E36 my E46 will be relegated to easier cruises and for when I need to take a nicer car. Hope that helps. ----- Original Message ---- From: Shelhart2@aol.com To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Wednesday, July 5, 2006 11:36:53 AM Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 14:33:27 EDT From: Shelhart2@aol.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? I sold my 98 to a fellow lister and bought a 2004 Silver Gray coupe 1 year ago. The additional horsepower is great and it is a bit more modern and "grown up" looking. The ride was much too soft and it definately feels heavier than my E36. The rasp in the exhaust note was irritating to me, however, some like it. To me it sounds weak. The shifter had too much play as well. I think for the bang for your buck it is better to stay with the E36. It ends up being a simple factor of how much money you have to part with and the strength of your personal balance sheet. I've since put an adjustable Dinan suspension, 19" BBS RSGT rims, Rogue short shifter, Rogue underdrive pullies, a new cold air intake and a UUC "Rasp X" pipe to eliminate the rasp. The car looks great and now feels quite a bit stiffer. It is still not as stiff as my 98 but has more get up and go. Bottom line is that I miss the 98 but had a little cash and was getting bored. I like the E46 and will hold onto it. Not too many regrets. The new 2 seater coupe certainlky looks like an interesting option... Shel ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#2. rtab R&R q - from Dave Thomas
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 11:48:58 -0700 From: Dave Thomas <dave@sasdatalink.com> Subject: rtab R&R q Hey All, Recently the trailing arm bushings on our '95 M3 went bad *real* quick and while I have plans to replace all the rubber in the rear suspension fairly soon, I don't have the time to get into everything at the moment, so I am going to just change the rtab's this weekend as they are so bad that the car feels squirrely on some of the crappier roads we have around here. I am going to try and do this 'on the car' and while I don't have any special BMW tools, I have enough of my homemade tools for E30 busing/bearing tasks that I think it should not be an issue. If it turns ugly...I'll just pull the arm and use my big hydraulic press. Anyway, can anyone give the the dimensions of the rtab so I can check and make sure I have a puller rigged up and ready to go? My new bushings wont be here until Friday so I cant check them out myself at this point. I just hate having parts ready to install while I hunt around for a tool ;-) Thanks, Dave T.
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#3. Re: e36 v e46 M3; opinions? - from Jason Lombard
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 12:03:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Jason Lombard <jrlombard@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: e36 v e46 M3; opinions? Jason, I'm one of those that has been the E46 M3 route, and have now returned to the E36. My experience was that while the S54 is a phenomenal motor (with amazingly high piston speeds) the rest of the car felt big, heavy, and somewhat ponderous. YMMV. I've been back in an E36 for about 8 months now, and have not regretted the decision once. I favor handling over horsepower, and out of the box, I just like the E36 better. My buddy who is an engineer for a major BMW tuner starting with a "D", says that he (and all of their data) disagrees. Regardless, it was the right decision for me. Jason Lombard '95 M3 Alpine White (sold-- big mistake) '01 M3 Titanium Silver (traded in on X5 for the wife) '96 Dakar II (ahhhh, just right) ---- From: Jason Olin <jtolin64@yahoo.com> Subject: e36 v e46 M3; opinions? I'm thinking of selling my 97 M3, and want to see how you folks would contrast an e36 M3v an e46 M3 as a daily driver . I plan to go test drive one, but want to hear from those of you who have more experience than I would get from a 20 minute test drive. My M3 really is a lot of fun (compared to a Mini Cooper S, Saab 9-3, c320). Is the added HP more fun...or hard to control? Is the steering as light? Does the car feel as tossable? Is the gearbox as mushy? Has anyone switched to an e46 and said, "why did I do this?" I recall someone writing a few years back that they disliked the M5 because it didn't seem as much fun as the M3, so I'm curious. I'd probably go for a 2003-2004 model. Thanks, Jason
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#4. Factory lwt wing - from Jstowe
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 13:28:37 -0700 From: "Jstowe" <jrstowe@comcast.net> Subject: Factory lwt wing Did the the factory lightweight wing have an integrated brakelight? thnx Jeff
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#5. Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? - from Zack Steinkamp
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 14:24:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Zack Steinkamp <thenobot@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? Jason -- I sold my 1998 E36 Sedan and purchased a 2005 E46 Coupe a year ago. The E36 had H&R coilovers, RD Sport swaybars, and 17x9 RGRs all around, so balance of the stock (brand new) E46 car was a bit disappointing in stock form. However, a call to Ground Control for their "Street/Track" coilover/camber plate kit + front swaybar and a few hours of work fixed that right up ;-). E36 Advantages: - lighter - sexier engine noise (subjective) - more responsive handling vs. stock E46 - cheaper - less of a guilty feeling when flogging it on the track (see above) - better autocross car (lighter, narrower) E46 Advantages: - absolutely magnificent engine - 6 speed tranny with a real overdrive gear - "M-Track Mode" on Competition Package cars (2005+) is actually great on the track -- not intrusive, but there when you need it - Luxury/Convenience (nav, bluetooth, adjustable width seats, etc) - safer (a decade of engineering + airbags galore) For track days I have a set of 18x9 OEM wheels (four rears) that really make the handling come alive, especially combined with the suspension upgrades. I have not regretted the move. The E46 car is wonderful. I look forward to driving it whenever I can. I consider mine the Ultimate Daily Driver, Grocery Hauler, Track Moster Compromise Machine. -zs --- Jason Olin <jtolin64@yahoo.com> wrote: > Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 10:25:29 -0700 (PDT) > From: Jason Olin <jtolin64@yahoo.com> > Subject: e36 v e46 M3; opinions? > > I'm thinking of selling my 97 M3, and want to see how you folks would > contrast an e36 M3v an e46 M3 as a daily driver . I plan to go test > drive one, but want to hear from those of you who have more > experience than I would get from a 20 minute test drive. My M3 > really is a lot of fun (compared to a Mini Cooper S, Saab 9-3, c320). > Is the added HP more fun...or hard to control? Is the steering as > light? Does the car feel as tossable? Is the gearbox as mushy? Has > anyone switched to an e46 and said, "why did I do this?" I recall > someone writing a few years back that they disliked the M5 because it > didn't seem as much fun as the M3, so I'm curious. I'd probably go > for a 2003-2004 model. > > Thanks, > > Jason > > 98K mi; coupe, Koni suspension, Sharked software and intake > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > >
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#6. Re: [E36M3] Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver - from Zack Steinkamp
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 14:28:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Zack Steinkamp <thenobot@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver --- Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> wrote: > On the other hand it's not practical to have a Chronometer Police to > control > personal use of self-contained in car timing devices, from > stopwatches to > data acquisition systems. These also arguably have legitimate value > for > measuring individual driver development. In-car video can be a great way to ascertain lap times. I review each day's runs and look at what driving changes gave the best times. True, it's not even close to real-time, but does help in the long run (especially at 2-day events). The timing is also pretty low-res (accurate to maybe a tenth of a second), but I'm at the level when I'm hacking off 10+ seconds over the course of a day ;-). -zs
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#7. Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? - from Gary
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 16:47:31 -0500 From: "Gary" <probikeguy@probikeusa.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? I'll stick with my E36 M3...add turbocharging, killer suspension, and some stoptech brakes. I think my 95 M3 3.2 turbo, hot rod suspenders, big honking brakes..etc etc.. will be fairly potent on the track ;-) Guess we will see in a month or so! Once I get it finished and tuned, engine, and suspension. Then its time from some track testing. I can't wait to pass a few fast P cars, and Z06's! The E46 is a nice car but the dash looks HUGE compared to my 95. Hell the whole car felt huge in comparison to my 95...It felt much like my 87 535 in raw size and weight. Gary Smelling boost.... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Zack Steinkamp" <thenobot@yahoo.com> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Wednesday, July 05, 2006 4:26 PM Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? > Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 14:24:15 -0700 (PDT) > From: Zack Steinkamp <thenobot@yahoo.com> > Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? > > Jason -- > > I sold my 1998 E36 Sedan and purchased a 2005 E46 Coupe a year ago. > The E36 had H&R coilovers, RD Sport swaybars, and 17x9 RGRs all around, > so balance of the stock (brand new) E46 car was a bit disappointing in > stock form. However, a call to Ground Control for their "Street/Track" > coilover/camber plate kit + front swaybar and a few hours of work fixed > that right up ;-). > > E36 Advantages: > - lighter > - sexier engine noise (subjective) > - more responsive handling vs. stock E46 > - cheaper > - less of a guilty feeling when flogging it on the track (see above) > - better autocross car (lighter, narrower) > > E46 Advantages: > - absolutely magnificent engine > - 6 speed tranny with a real overdrive gear > - "M-Track Mode" on Competition Package cars (2005+) is actually great > on the track -- not intrusive, but there when you need it > - Luxury/Convenience (nav, bluetooth, adjustable width seats, etc) > - safer (a decade of engineering + airbags galore) > > For track days I have a set of 18x9 OEM wheels (four rears) that really > make the handling come alive, especially combined with the suspension > upgrades. > > I have not regretted the move. The E46 car is wonderful. I look > forward to driving it whenever I can. I consider mine the Ultimate > Daily Driver, Grocery Hauler, Track Moster Compromise Machine. > > -zs > > --- Jason Olin <jtolin64@yahoo.com> wrote: > >> Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 10:25:29 -0700 (PDT) >> From: Jason Olin <jtolin64@yahoo.com> >> Subject: e36 v e46 M3; opinions? >> >> I'm thinking of selling my 97 M3, and want to see how you folks would >> contrast an e36 M3v an e46 M3 as a daily driver . I plan to go test >> drive one, but want to hear from those of you who have more >> experience than I would get from a 20 minute test drive. My M3 >> really is a lot of fun (compared to a Mini Cooper S, Saab 9-3, c320). >> Is the added HP more fun...or hard to control? Is the steering as >> light? Does the car feel as tossable? Is the gearbox as mushy? Has >> anyone switched to an e46 and said, "why did I do this?" I recall >> someone writing a few years back that they disliked the M5 because it >> didn't seem as much fun as the M3, so I'm curious. I'd probably go >> for a 2003-2004 model. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Jason >> >> 98K mi; coupe, Koni suspension, Sharked software and intake >> >> >> ************************************************* >> Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: >> >> Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com >> Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com >> Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com >> Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com >> Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com >> Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com >> >> DIGEST INFORMATION: >> http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm >> ************************************************* >> >> >> > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > >
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#8. Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver - from Neil Maller
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Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2006 18:07:29 -0400 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver on 7/5/06 12:19 PM, Gus Iverson at gus.iverson@gmail.com wrote: > Interestingly enough, when I switched to State Farm insurance here in > WA, I did so because the local CCA chapter members indicated that they > were willing to cover incidents at track events. I asked a number of > pointed questions about this and was told that it would be accecptable > to carry a timing device in my car at a HPDE event because it would be > considered a teaching tool. Well, I like their attitude! However I received the following from someone here in Indiana recently: > While speaking with my local State Farm rep, I was informed that autocross and > driving schools would no longer be covered (no liability, no damage, no > medical) as of any cars 6-month policy anniversary falling after 6/1/2006. Insurance policies are written and regulated on a state level, so what applies Indiana may not in Washington. Or it may... Neil 96 M3
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#9. Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? - from Zack Steinkamp
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 15:09:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Zack Steinkamp <thenobot@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] e36 v e46 M3; opinions? --- Gary <probikeguy@probikeusa.com> wrote: > I'll stick with my E36 M3...add turbocharging, killer suspension, > and some > stoptech brakes. > I think my 95 M3 3.2 turbo, hot rod suspenders, big honking > brakes..etc > etc.. will be fairly potent on the track ;-) Sure, but will it have Bluetooth and Sat-Nav? Just kidding, ;-) zs
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#10. Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver - from Gus Iverson
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Date: Wed, 5 Jul 2006 15:09:49 -0700 From: "Gus Iverson" <gus.iverson@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Mounting Hot Lap Timer Receiver Fun, just got my own renewal notice. Time to call the agent again... On 7/5/06, Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> wrote: > on 7/5/06 12:19 PM, Gus Iverson at gus.iverson@gmail.com wrote: > > > Interestingly enough, when I switched to State Farm insurance here in > > WA, I did so because the local CCA chapter members indicated that they > > were willing to cover incidents at track events. I asked a number of > > pointed questions about this and was told that it would be accecptable > > to carry a timing device in my car at a HPDE event because it would be > > considered a teaching tool. > > Well, I like their attitude! However I received the following from someone > here in Indiana recently: > > > While speaking with my local State Farm rep, I was informed that autocross and > > driving schools would no longer be covered (no liability, no damage, no > > medical) as of any cars 6-month policy anniversary falling after 6/1/2006. > > Insurance policies are written and regulated on a state level, so what > applies Indiana may not in Washington. Or it may... > > Neil > 96 M3 > > >