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#1. Re: [E36M3] Head Gasket - Bummer - from Jim Bassett
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Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 22:16:10 -0800 (PST) From: "Jim Bassett" <jim@jimbassett.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Head Gasket - Bummer On Sat, November 25, 2006 7:03 pm, Mark Duckworth said: > Then we're getting into the neighborhood of unreclaimed costs. I'd be > willing to bet I could never get what I put into it in resale - yet I > can't really afford to start building my race car yet, nor would I want > to with this thing. The rest of the car is too perfect to get thrashed > on a race track. For me, it's an issue of will I be keeping the car, or do I plan to sell it in the near future? I plan on keeping the car for a while, so for me rebuilding (or replacing) the bottom end in the next 2 years (before the next smog inspection) makes sense. Your perspective may be different. > I'm sure it's prudent to rebuild the head but I don't know if I can > stomach $3K right around the holidays. Oh, sorry, I thought you mentioned you had a $5K budget. Keep in mind the $3K cost was having my mechanic do all the work; it may be cheaper as a DIY project. > Just put a ring on my girl's finger. Congratulations. > I might as well spend my $20K on my love which is this car. I know the feeling. And it was reinforced this holiday as we drove the 50 or so miles to Kim's family for Thanksgiving. Accelerating onto the freeway still elicts a "Wheeee!" from Nikolas. And a few high-speed corners as well. How can one "trade" that in? :-) > With a bunch of mods I could probably wipe the floor with an E46 and get > better road feel on top of it. Aside from the power the E46 has > nothing Having put all 175,000+ miles on the M3, I can honestly say getting in and driving the car goes beyond the cliches of "it fits like a glove" or "it's like putting on an old pair of tennis shoes". Jim Bassett 1998 M3/4 1993 325is #44 JP
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#2. Re: [E36M3] UUC SS brake lines install - from Martin Bullen
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 07:37:27 -0500 From: Martin Bullen <vze322dw@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] UUC SS brake lines install Kurt, There should be a small spring clip, between the hard line and the bracket, that you reuse. It's item 10 in this diagram: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do? model=BF93&mospid=47486&btnr=34_0487&hg=34&fg=15 It's responsible for holding the lines into the bracket. Otherwise, make sure the bracket and the clips are clean of accumulated crud, and it "should" all go back together. Don't you love struggling with brake fittings as the fluid slowly runs down your arms :-) HTH, Martin Bullen '95 M3 '97 Z3 2.8 On Nov 26, 2006, at 1:23 AM, E36M3 wrote: > Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 22:12:47 -0800 (PST) > From: Kurt Hoofnagle <kurthoofnagle@yahoo.com> > Subject: Question: UUC SS brake lines install > > Ok, I plan to call Rob on Monday on this, but I was > hoping to get the car back on the road this > weekend--hoping someone can help here. > > Car is a 7/95 production 95 and as part of a brake > caliper rebuild I am replacing the factory brake lines > with UUC SS lines. I just installed the right front > UUC SS line and the fitting on the end of the SS line > where it joins the hard line slips right through the > bracket, so even when the SS line is tightened to the > hard line their junction is loose on the bracket. To > be even more clear, the fitting on the end of the SS > hose is smaller in diameter than the hole in the > bracket welded to the inner fender. Thus, the soft > line is not rigidly held in place by the bracket. > > The old factory rubber line's metal fitting has a > "shoulder" which keeps the fitting from slipping > through the bracket. > > Anyone BTDT? What am I missing here? Many thanks. > > Kurt Hoofnagle
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#3. Re: [E36M3] Head Gasket - Bummer - from Martin Bullen
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 07:51:40 -0500 From: Martin Bullen <vze322dw@verizon.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Head Gasket - Bummer Mark, I agree with your headgasket diagnosis. It's a doable DIY for a patient and competent amateur with a decent selection of tools. There are some pretty good instructions here: http://www.pelicanparts.com/bmw/techarticles/101-Projects-17-Head- Gasket/101-Projects-17-Head-Gasket.htm Your choice is really in how far you go. It's a slippery slope when you take the head off (BTDT). You could pretty much literally slap a new head gasket on to get you by until you have more money/time/sell the car or just until whenever, or you could go to the complete opposite extreme. You'll never get your money out of any additional work, especially in a 181k mile 10+ year old car. Unless you have visions of making the car a dedicated track machine I'd lean towards the former direction, fixing anything obvious while you're in there, but not looking too hard for things to spend money on. Then drive it until it drops. Just my $.02, but save your pennies for something newer and/or lower miles, and enjoy the M3 more- or-less as it is, until you've saved enough pennies to move on. Good luck, Martin Bullen '95 M3 '97 Z3 2.8 On Nov 26, 2006, at 1:23 AM, E36M3 wrote: > Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 15:08:02 -0500 > From: Mark Duckworth <mdlkml@atari-source.com> > Subject: Head Gasket - Bummer > > Hey guys, > > In a rough time like this I need some of your collective wisdom, > car is > a 1996 S52 M3 with 181,000 miles. In a fit of some fun driving I > believe I turned a leaking head gasket into a blown head gasket. > > For the last month I started having some phantom coolant loss. I > did a > pressure test and found some loss through the overflow hose so I > tightened that up and thought I was fine. I also found some issue > with > the coolant temperature sensor, found that and fixed. Then I thought, > hrmm this is a little strange that stuff will start leaking all the > sudden. Almost seems like coolant overpressurization. Almost seems > like when my chevy blew it's head gasket. > > I left it sit overnight and when I went out this morning I looked for > wet spots and could find none. Where's the coolant been leaking, > then I > took off the oil cap and found this: > > http://picasaweb.google.com/evaporated/M3HeadGasket > > In all of your expert opinions, is there any reason for the slurry > other > than coolant mixing in? The car has been my daily driver and has not > been exhibiting (much) power loss in recent months. I've heard it can > get the slurry from moisture buildup from sitting but I've driven > it 25 > miles each way to work and back the last 7 days. > > When you inevitably tell me it's head gasket, can you suggest an > approximate repair cost and whether or not a moderately intelligent > DIYer should attempt it? (I do bushings, tie rod ends, brakes, oil, > electronic repairs, radiator, ignition repairs, etc) > > I don't drive it in the winter which begins for us around mid-december > so this isn't that big of a tradgedy since my repair budget is > virtually > untouched on this car. > > If I want to keep this car running, does the lower end generally > outlast > the top end or should I be looking to rebuild completely. Should I > do a > valve job? What kind of costs could I be getting into? I have about > $5K to spend. Any other suggested work while the head is off relating > to vanos, etc? > > Looking for some opinions from experienced readers. > > Thanks, > Mark > (guess I'm 100% motorcycle rider and 1995 3000GT drive for now)
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#4. Re: [E36M3] Question: UUC SS brake lines install - from Jay Hudson
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 06:56:46 -0800 From: "Jay Hudson" <jwhud@budget.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Question: UUC SS brake lines install I just used zip ties to hold in place. No problems so far. Jay ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Hoofnagle" <kurthoofnagle@yahoo.com> To: "E36M3" <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Saturday, November 25, 2006 10:13 PM Subject: [E36M3] Question: UUC SS brake lines install Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 22:12:47 -0800 (PST) From: Kurt Hoofnagle <kurthoofnagle@yahoo.com> Subject: Question: UUC SS brake lines install Ok, I plan to call Rob on Monday on this, but I was hoping to get the car back on the road this weekend--hoping someone can help here. Car is a 7/95 production 95 and as part of a brake caliper rebuild I am replacing the factory brake lines with UUC SS lines. I just installed the right front UUC SS line and the fitting on the end of the SS line where it joins the hard line slips right through the bracket, so even when the SS line is tightened to the hard line their junction is loose on the bracket. To be even more clear, the fitting on the end of the SS hose is smaller in diameter than the hole in the bracket welded to the inner fender. Thus, the soft line is not rigidly held in place by the bracket. The old factory rubber line's metal fitting has a "shoulder" which keeps the fitting from slipping through the bracket. Anyone BTDT? What am I missing here? Many thanks. Kurt Hoofnagle ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#5. Head Gasket - Bummer - from Rich Dorffer
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 11:21:22 -0500 From: "Rich Dorffer" <E36M3Digest@gmail.com> Subject: Head Gasket - Bummer > > From: Mark Duckworth <mdlkml@atari-source.com> > > If we're talking top and bottom being prudent it might be worth it to > just go for a Bavarian Engine Exchange motor. $6500. First off, go to a reputable engine builder if you are going to go for a whole motor. Secondly, you could have your motor rebuilt this winter for a lot less than $6,500. I'm sure it's prudent to rebuild the head but I don't know if I can > stomach $3K right around the holidays. I really don't have it at all. > Just put a ring on my girl's finger. Well then, you really don't have it if that is the case. :-) Just put on a new head gasket for now, it won't cost that much and if the car ran well (good compression) with moderate oil usage before the head gasket problem, you should be good to go for a while. I have dreams of stroker with shrick cams and a Vac stage 3 head pumping > 300+ NA, but with saving up for a house I was kind of looking to get out > of the M3 at least temporarily. I was hoping for an E46 at some point > but I keep hearing such awful reviews about them combined with the high > ticket, I might as well spend my $20K on my love which is this car. > With a bunch of mods I could probably wipe the floor with an E46 and get > better road feel on top of it. Aside from the power the E46 has > nothing If you want to do that, just go with the Eurosport kit, it is really quite amazing, works really well and looks great. Regards, Rich
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#6. Re: [E36M3] UUC SS brake lines install - from jeff.conner@yahoo.com
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 09:13:47 -0800 (PST) From: jeff.conner@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] UUC SS brake lines install Kurt, Martin is correct. The clip should be there. And to paraphrase Jay, "Zip ties are your friend" Another word of caution. I would seriously consider giving all the threads a shot with liquid wrench or something similar, especially in the back. When I was doing my 98, one of the connections at the "S" in the rear line - the hard line between the two flexible lines in the back - was completely seized. So much so that I had to break the nut to get the line off, thus, completely rendering the line useless. After two hours of paitient work, my gearhead neighbor had managed to bend the straigt line that the BMW stealership sold me into an almost perfect replica of the original part - when it was new of course :-). Basically, what I'm saying is this....be reeeeeallly careful when you disconnet the original lines, or you may be spending even MORE time trying to get everything connected. Good Luck -jeff 98 ///Sedan ----- Original Message ---- From: Martin Bullen <vze322dw@verizon.net> To: E36M3 <e36m3@bmw-m.net> Sent: Sunday, November 26, 2006 4:43:52 AM Subject: Re: [E36M3] UUC SS brake lines install Kurt, There should be a small spring clip, between the hard line and the bracket, that you reuse. It's item 10 in this diagram: http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do? model=BF93&mospid=47486&btnr=34_0487&hg=34&fg=15 It's responsible for holding the lines into the bracket. Otherwise, make sure the bracket and the clips are clean of accumulated crud, and it "should" all go back together. Don't you love struggling with brake fittings as the fluid slowly runs down your arms :-) HTH, Martin Bullen '95 M3 '97 Z3 2.8 On Nov 26, 2006, at 1:23 AM, E36M3 wrote: > Date: Sat, 25 Nov 2006 22:12:47 -0800 (PST) > From: Kurt Hoofnagle <kurthoofnagle@yahoo.com> > Subject: Question: UUC SS brake lines install > > Ok, I plan to call Rob on Monday on this, but I was > hoping to get the car back on the road this > weekend--hoping someone can help here. > > Car is a 7/95 production 95 and as part of a brake > caliper rebuild I am replacing the factory brake lines > with UUC SS lines. I just installed the right front > UUC SS line and the fitting on the end of the SS line > where it joins the hard line slips right through the > bracket, so even when the SS line is tightened to the > hard line their junction is loose on the bracket. To > be even more clear, the fitting on the end of the SS > hose is smaller in diameter than the hole in the > bracket welded to the inner fender. Thus, the soft > line is not rigidly held in place by the bracket. > > The old factory rubber line's metal fitting has a > "shoulder" which keeps the fitting from slipping > through the bracket. > > Anyone BTDT? What am I missing here? Many thanks. > > Kurt Hoofnagle ____________________________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Music Unlimited Access over 1 million songs. http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited
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#7. Re: Head Gasket - Bummer - from Neil Maller
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 13:15:26 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Re: Head Gasket - Bummer on 11/26/06 1:23 AM, Mark Duckworth <mdlkml@atari-source.com> wrote: > I took off the oil cap and found this: > http://picasaweb.google.com/evaporated/M3HeadGasket Under your pics it says "Report inappropriate content." Yep, there's entirely inappropriate coolant content in your oil. BTDT. > When you inevitably tell me it's head gasket, can you suggest an > approximate repair cost Dollars to donuts it's the head gasket. Depending on where you live and the prevailing labour costs it'll be someplace upward of $2K. > and whether or not a moderately intelligent DIYer should attempt it? (I do > bushings, tie rod ends, brakes, oil, electronic repairs, radiator, ignition > repairs, etc) As usual with these things there's a trade-off between time, money and risk. If you have reasonable mechanical sense, a good set of regular tools and a place to work you should be able to do it. It'll take a full weekend, much of which is spent removing a surprising amount of stuff to get to the head itself. You'll also need a helper for the actual head removal and replacing part, since it's large, heavy, awkward and delicate. Gaskets will run a couple of hundred or so, you'll need new head bolts, plus there are some special tools you must have (cam lock fixture; VANOS timing tools; head bolt socket tool; other odds and ends I've probably forgotten about). They'll likely run about $300-400 to buy. > If I want to keep this car running, does the lower end generally outlast > the top end or should I be looking to rebuild completely. The bottom end of these engines is pretty robust. > Should I do a valve job? What kind of costs could I be getting into? I have > about $5K to spend. However with your engine's mileage, and since you have another car to drive in the meanwhile, it might be worth taking off the head yourself but then sending it off to be refurbished. A compression/leakdown test would likely give you some prior guidance. > Any other suggested work while the head is off relating to vanos, etc? Last week I stumbled over two different used E36 M3 engines, each with mileage only in the 20K range, on offer for under $4K a piece. I'm pretty sure that any kind of a worthwhile engine rebuild would run more than that. If you decide to do the head gasket yourself I have some notes from when I did mine a couple of years ago. Neil Fort Wayne, IN 96 M3 - Bastard child 03 525iT - Sterling Grey Metallic 05 Mini - Cooper S with LSD
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#8. Short final drive ratio/6-speed - from Neil Maller
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 13:57:31 -0500 From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> Subject: Short final drive ratio/6-speed There's a reasonably priced used 3.46 LSD final drive available for me to buy. The motivation would be better acceleration on the track with the ability to carry 4th gear usefully in places where I'm now running out of revs in 3rd. But would a 3.46 make enough difference for that? However my M3, while a dedicated track car, is and likely always will be driven to the track. These are typically under 3-hour journeys, but I'm also interested in going to some different and much more distant tracks. So I have concerns about droning along the freeway for hours at higher rpm. The ideal technical solution might be a 6-speed transmission. The easiest would be either from a Euro E36 M3 or the GS6-37BZ unit used in the E46 330i. Either of these would allow keeping my fairly recent UUC lightweight flywheel and Sachs HD M5 clutch, whereas the E46 M3 6-speed has a larger diameter input shaft that would obsolete those parts. OTOH the difference between 3.46 and my existing 3.23 is only about 7%, or 250 rpm at freeway speeds, so maybe it's either a) not worth worrying about, or b) fitting a 6-speed suggests being more aggressive with the final drive ratio. Either of these transmissions also requires a bunch of supporting parts, in the E46 option's case adding up to well over $2K according to: <http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com/store/shop.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=613 4&Product_Code=6SP000-1&Category_Code=6SPC>. (Zionsville is local to me.) Plus there's the (unknown to me) cost of a used 6-speed box, which may not be at all easy to find for a reasonable price. BTW, I would do the installation myself, so that part of the cost doesn't enter into it. Right now I'm in the vaguest "gee, what if?" phase on this. I'd be interested in anybody's BTDT stories or other input that helps me to think this option through. Neil Fort Wayne, IN 96 M3 - Bastard child 03 525iT - Sterling Grey Metallic 05 Mini - Cooper S with LSD
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#9. Re: [E36M3] Short final drive ratio/6-speed - from Jay Hudson
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 11:27:12 -0800 From: "Jay Hudson" <jwhud@budget.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Short final drive ratio/6-speed Go to diffsonline.com. Under the tech section is a mph/rpm calculator. You can make comparisons between your existing ratio and any others you may consider. I run one of their 3.64 diffs in my car. A 3.73 would also be a good choice, considering a 5-speed. For track only, at the tracks I frequent, I could also be happy with a 3.91. Maybe even a 4.10. Diffsonline is great. Jay > Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 13:57:31 -0500 > From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> > Subject: Short final drive ratio/6-speed > > There's a reasonably priced used 3.46 LSD final drive available for me to > buy. The motivation would be better acceleration on the track with the > ability to carry 4th gear usefully in places where I'm now running out of > revs in 3rd. But would a 3.46 make enough difference for that? > > However my M3, while a dedicated track car, is and likely always will be > driven to the track. These are typically under 3-hour journeys, but I'm > also > interested in going to some different and much more distant tracks. > > So I have concerns about droning along the freeway for hours at higher > rpm. > > The ideal technical solution might be a 6-speed transmission. The easiest > would be either from a Euro E36 M3 or the GS6-37BZ unit used in the E46 > 330i. Either of these would allow keeping my fairly recent UUC lightweight > flywheel and Sachs HD M5 clutch, whereas the E46 M3 6-speed has a larger > diameter input shaft that would obsolete those parts. > > OTOH the difference between 3.46 and my existing 3.23 is only about 7%, or > 250 rpm at freeway speeds, so maybe it's either a) not worth worrying > about, > or b) fitting a 6-speed suggests being more aggressive with the final > drive > ratio. > > Either of these transmissions also requires a bunch of supporting parts, > in > the E46 option's case adding up to well over $2K according to: > <http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com/store/shop.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=613 > 4&Product_Code=6SP000-1&Category_Code=6SPC>. (Zionsville is local to me.) > > Plus there's the (unknown to me) cost of a used 6-speed box, which may not > be at all easy to find for a reasonable price. BTW, I would do the > installation myself, so that part of the cost doesn't enter into it. > > Right now I'm in the vaguest "gee, what if?" phase on this. I'd be > interested in anybody's BTDT stories or other input that helps me to think > this option through. > > Neil > Fort Wayne, IN > 96 M3 - Bastard child > 03 525iT - Sterling Grey Metallic > 05 Mini - Cooper S with LSD
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#10. Re: [E36M3] Short final drive ratio/6-speed - from docwyte@comcast.net
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Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 19:54:36 +0000 From: docwyte@comcast.net Subject: Re: [E36M3] Short final drive ratio/6-speed I had a 3.38 in my '95 M3 for awhile. It was very nice, but it eventually burned up on me. (Previous owner didn't change the diff oil, I changed it once I bought the car, it came out black and a year later the diff was done) I ended up putting in a 3.23 instead. I noticed a little drop in acceleration (the car had an AA supercharger on it) and I gained about 1.5mpg. I didn't really notice much as far as noise, etc at highway cruising speeds, the rpm drop wasn't all that much. My feeling is your experience will be the same with the 3.46. You won't really notice it all that much more on the freeway, besides the drop in mpg. I'd go with the 3.46 vs the 6 speed tranny unless you need to replace your current tranny. Diffsonline are a great group of guys to deal with. -------------- Original message -------------- From: Neil Maller <neil.maller@gte.net> > Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 13:57:31 -0500 > From: Neil Maller > Subject: Short final drive ratio/6-speed > > There's a reasonably priced used 3.46 LSD final drive available for me to > buy. The motivation would be better acceleration on the track with the > ability to carry 4th gear usefully in places where I'm now running out of > revs in 3rd. But would a 3.46 make enough difference for that? >