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#1. Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Gus Iverson
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 10:18:26 -0700 From: "Gus Iverson" <gus.iverson@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience That doesn't seem worth the cost for the cams. My car, with K&N and Conforti software, put down 222.2 at a Dynojet dyno last fall. (Carb Connection for the PNW locals) Now, different dynos take different readings. Perhaps you were using a Mustang dyno? They report lower numbers than the Dynojets due to a different testing methodology and whatnot. On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 12:10:39 -0400 > From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > The day I had my car dyno'd with Stage 1 s/c kit, there was a guy with a '98 > testing his Turner cam Kit. (I believe it was called a Stage IV kit). I > know there are lots of variables involved in dyno testing (e.g. it was a > cool January morning, not cold), but what he posted on the dynojet was max > torque = 234.9, max power = 227.2. Not sure what, if any, other mods he had > on the car. > > By comparison that day, I posted 246.5 max torque and 297.5 max power with > the Stage I supercharger from Active. We did a comparison chart overlay of > the two cars. Basically, up to about 3750 rpm the cars had very similar > torque/power curves. The cam kit's peek torque was at 3750. Above 3750, > the supercharger had the advantage, keeping the torque high (225 lb/ft or > higher) throughout the rest of the rev range, thus leading to the much > higher overall power figure. The cam kit's torque trailed off noticeably > after 3750. > > Matt Bader > 98 M3/4 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: George R Carr Jr [mailto:georgercarrjr@earthlink.net] > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 9:25 AM > To: E36M3 > Subject: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 08:20:02 -0500 > From: George R Carr Jr <georgercarrjr@earthlink.net> > Subject: Cam kit experience > > I'm about to decide on a Cam kit for my 98. What experiences/advice > might users have? I've (of course) been looking at the > Eurosport/Turner kits. Turner has the header option as well. > > TIA. > George > -- > =========================== > georgercarrjr@earthlink.net > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > >
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#2. [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Daniel Lowe
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 13:36:36 -0400 From: "Daniel Lowe" <blackjackbimmer@gmail.com> Subject: [E36M3] Cam kit experience Check out my before and after graphs. Haven't had anyone respond regarding why I had essentially no improvement when adding cams, bigger injectors, Euro MAF, etc. Certainly doesn't appear to be worth even a $1 for the results I achieved. Regards, Dan > temporarily housed here: > > http://www.christopherbauer.net/dyno/11-2004%20dyno%20graph.jpg > > http://www.christopherbauer.net/dyno/11-2004%20dyno%20detail%20pg3.jpg > > http://www.christopherbauer.net/dyno/11-2004%20dyno%20detail%20pg2.jpg > > http://www.christopherbauer.net/dyno/11-2004%20dyno%20detail%20pg1.jpg > > http://www.christopherbauer.net/dyno/03-2007%20dyno%20graph.jpg >
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#3. Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Rex Tener
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 10:55:49 -0700 From: Rex Tener <rex_tener@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience At 10:45 AM 5/28/2007, Daniel Lowe wrote: >Check out my before and after graphs. Haven't had anyone respond regarding >why I had essentially no improvement when adding cams, bigger injectors, >Euro MAF, etc. Certainly doesn't appear to be worth even a $1 for the >results I achieved. Which vendor made the kit you installed? Have you talked to them about your results? Rex
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#4. Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Carlos Lopez
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 14:11:39 -0400 From: "Carlos Lopez" <clopez98m3@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 12:10:39 -0400 > From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > The day I had my car dyno'd with Stage 1 s/c kit, there was a guy with a '98 > testing his Turner cam Kit. (I believe it was called a Stage IV kit). I > know there are lots of variables involved in dyno testing (e.g. it was a > cool January morning, not cold), but what he posted on the dynojet was max > torque = 234.9, max power = 227.2. Not sure what, if any, other mods he had > on the car. That doesn't sound right at all. I'd bet a stock 3.2 like mine with intake, software and other easy stuff has more power than that. A cam kit should take that car to nearly 300hp (crank), not sure what that is at the wheels. I think the high horsepower IP club racers are getting in the 270+hp to the wheels range. Carlos 98 M3 ran well at Mid-Ohio this weekend :-)
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#5. RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Matt Bader
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 14:21:37 -0400 From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience It was a dynojet and, I agree, that unless you have a philosophical commitment to naturally aspirated engines, it is not worth the money. I didn't get a chance to talk to the guy, but I would have been disappointed at those numbers as well. -----Original Message----- From: Gus Iverson [mailto:gus.iverson@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 1:25 PM To: E36M3 Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 10:18:26 -0700 From: "Gus Iverson" <gus.iverson@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience That doesn't seem worth the cost for the cams. My car, with K&N and Conforti software, put down 222.2 at a Dynojet dyno last fall. (Carb Connection for the PNW locals) Now, different dynos take different readings. Perhaps you were using a Mustang dyno? They report lower numbers than the Dynojets due to a different testing methodology and whatnot. On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 12:10:39 -0400 > From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > The day I had my car dyno'd with Stage 1 s/c kit, there was a guy with a '98 > testing his Turner cam Kit. (I believe it was called a Stage IV kit). I > know there are lots of variables involved in dyno testing (e.g. it was a > cool January morning, not cold), but what he posted on the dynojet was max > torque = 234.9, max power = 227.2. Not sure what, if any, other mods he had > on the car. > > By comparison that day, I posted 246.5 max torque and 297.5 max power with > the Stage I supercharger from Active. We did a comparison chart overlay of > the two cars. Basically, up to about 3750 rpm the cars had very similar > torque/power curves. The cam kit's peek torque was at 3750. Above 3750, > the supercharger had the advantage, keeping the torque high (225 lb/ft or > higher) throughout the rest of the rev range, thus leading to the much > higher overall power figure. The cam kit's torque trailed off noticeably > after 3750. > > Matt Bader > 98 M3/4 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: George R Carr Jr [mailto:georgercarrjr@earthlink.net] > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2007 9:25 AM > To: E36M3 > Subject: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 08:20:02 -0500 > From: George R Carr Jr <georgercarrjr@earthlink.net> > Subject: Cam kit experience > > I'm about to decide on a Cam kit for my 98. What experiences/advice > might users have? I've (of course) been looking at the > Eurosport/Turner kits. Turner has the header option as well. > > TIA. > George > -- > =========================== > georgercarrjr@earthlink.net > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > > > > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > > ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#6. RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Matt Bader
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 14:21:37 -0400 From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience I have the graphs but can't post here. And we are talking wheel horsepower readings of course. The conversion ratio for wheel to crank hp is, if you want to be conservative, about 1.17 to 1. What does add credibility to the numbers is the fact that my car was tested on the same equipment/same day as the guy with the cam kit. And since my numbers came in close to what Active claimed they should be for the s/c kit, it makes me think the testing was reliable, and ditto for the cam kit. -----Original Message----- From: Carlos Lopez [mailto:clopez98m3@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 2:12 PM To: Matt Bader Cc: E36M3 Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 12:10:39 -0400 > From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > The day I had my car dyno'd with Stage 1 s/c kit, there was a guy with a '98 > testing his Turner cam Kit. (I believe it was called a Stage IV kit). I > know there are lots of variables involved in dyno testing (e.g. it was a > cool January morning, not cold), but what he posted on the dynojet was max > torque = 234.9, max power = 227.2. Not sure what, if any, other mods he had > on the car. That doesn't sound right at all. I'd bet a stock 3.2 like mine with intake, software and other easy stuff has more power than that. A cam kit should take that car to nearly 300hp (crank), not sure what that is at the wheels. I think the high horsepower IP club racers are getting in the 270+hp to the wheels range. Carlos 98 M3 ran well at Mid-Ohio this weekend :-)
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#7. Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Carlos Lopez
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 15:01:48 -0400 From: "Carlos Lopez" <clopez98m3@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > I have the graphs but can't post here. And we are talking wheel horsepower > readings of course. The conversion ratio for wheel to crank hp is, if you > want to be conservative, about 1.17 to 1. What does add credibility to the > numbers is the fact that my car was tested on the same equipment/same day as > the guy with the cam kit. And since my numbers came in close to what Active > claimed they should be for the s/c kit, it makes me think the testing was > reliable, and ditto for the cam kit. When I said it doesn't sound right I didn't mean that I doubt what you said. What I'm saying is that something got botched along the way. Install, cam timing, who knows. I like going to the track enough that I'll always stay away from FI, I don't have pockets deep enough <g>. I actually got a garage at Mid-Ohio this weekend because someone with a S/C had problems on Friday. I can't afford the kit, the downtime or the patience to be constantly chasing issues. Besides I don't need any more HP, I can already scare myself shitless as it is. ;-) Carlos 98 M3
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#8. door liner - from Brian Ruiz
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 14:44:49 -0700 From: "Brian Ruiz" <eurowerke@gmail.com> Subject: door liner Hey gang, I finally put my door panel back on after being off for about a year and a half due to my complete and utter laziness (and very little free time lately). I had it down to the bare window mechanism to clean up and replace a plastic window slider and re-grease the tracks. When I went to put the vinyl door liner back on, it seemed to have shrunk from the size it should be. I figured the vinyl was just dry so I gave it a good rubdown with some Vinylex and just went ahead and stuck it back on as best I could. However, it is torn on the top edge and probably could use replacing anyway, so I tried to track it down on realoem. Anyone know what the p/n is? Best I could find is #13 here, but not completely sure it's the right part. Can anyone confirm? http://realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=BF93&mospid=47486&btnr=51_2071&hg=51&fg=70 Thanks, Brian build 8/95
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#9. RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Matt Bader
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 20:05:46 -0400 From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience The Turner kit claims 300 crank horsepower which, roughly, should equal about 250 wheel horsepower. -----Original Message----- From: Carlos Lopez [mailto:clopez98m3@gmail.com] Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 2:15 PM To: E36M3 Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 14:11:39 -0400 From: "Carlos Lopez" <clopez98m3@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience On 5/28/07, Matt Bader <mbader@exammaster.com> wrote: > Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 12:10:39 -0400 > From: "Matt Bader" <mbader@exammaster.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Cam kit experience > > The day I had my car dyno'd with Stage 1 s/c kit, there was a guy with a '98 > testing his Turner cam Kit. (I believe it was called a Stage IV kit). I > know there are lots of variables involved in dyno testing (e.g. it was a > cool January morning, not cold), but what he posted on the dynojet was max > torque = 234.9, max power = 227.2. Not sure what, if any, other mods he had > on the car. That doesn't sound right at all. I'd bet a stock 3.2 like mine with intake, software and other easy stuff has more power than that. A cam kit should take that car to nearly 300hp (crank), not sure what that is at the wheels. I think the high horsepower IP club racers are getting in the 270+hp to the wheels range. Carlos 98 M3 ran well at Mid-Ohio this weekend :-) ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#10. Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience - from Daniel Lowe
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Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 20:56:49 -0400 From: "Daniel Lowe" <blackjackbimmer@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Cam kit experience The cams, software and MAF came from Turner and were installed by Payette Motorsport in Atlanta. No, not yet. Dan On 5/28/07, Rex Tener <rex_tener@yahoo.com> wrote: > > At 10:45 AM 5/28/2007, Daniel Lowe wrote: > >Check out my before and after graphs. Haven't had anyone respond > regarding > >why I had essentially no improvement when adding cams, bigger injectors, > >Euro MAF, etc. Certainly doesn't appear to be worth even a $1 for the > >results I achieved. > > Which vendor made the kit you installed? Have you talked to them > about your results? > > Rex > >