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#1. RE: [E36M3] Bridgestone RE-01R's - from Mark Duckworth
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Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 14:59:54 -0400 From: Mark Duckworth <mdlkml@atari-source.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Bridgestone RE-01R's On Tue, 2007-06-05 at 11:25 -0500, Alex Demsky wrote: > Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 12:19:05 -0400 > From: "Alex Demsky" <hyper_m3@hotmail.com> > Subject: RE: [E36M3] Bridgestone RE-01R's > > Can I ask what tire pressure you guys found to be the best? I havent liked > these tires since theyve been on my car. I cant feel anything on the road > the front end feels numb. > I prefer around 38lbs but since they just got put on I didn't adjust them so they're probably right at 36-37lbs. Thanks, Mark
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#2. Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events - from Raza Uddin
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 12:32:02 -0700 From: "Raza Uddin" <raza.uddin@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events On 6/5/07, Jim Bassett <jim@jimbassett.com> wrote: > > No disrespect, but that's a *driver* issue, not a tire issue. Going > full-steam on full-tread tires initially is just plain silly. Possibly, but no one ever made me aware of the fact that the tread might squirm that much. Once I expected the squirm, yes, I adjusted my driving. But, these are r-compound tires designed for racing and not some 10/32nds street tires, not even the Falken RT-615s I recently drove on at full tread did that. I guess maybe I expected more from them initially. > I've run a full-tread set on the race car, bought & mounted at AIM at > Sears on the track day and not had an issue. Could I feel the squirm > through T10? Hell, yes! :-) Did I expect it and adjust my driving to the > "conditions"? Yes. By the end of the day, they felt just fine. I think the amount of squirm you get is very much dependent on the car. A light, well-setup, suspensioned E36 is going to perform a helluva a lot better on the full tread RA-1s than a full-fat, stock suspension and wheeled 300zx Twin Turbo (which I was driving at the time). After it got too much, I parked the car since it wasn't mine and my brother would have killed me if I actually did launch it off the inside hill at T2. :) I went back to my Sentra SE-R on Yokohama Paradas (at full tread with no squirm) at the time. > There's a reason most race events start out with a "practice" session; an > advanced-level HPDE driver is probably at the point where the first > session of a track day should be used in a similar fashion. They squirmed throughout the session. It wasn't just a one-lap deal. I had done 2 laps driving at about 6-7/10ths and as I started to push, the squirm became apparent. I must add that the tires had been driven a total of 4-5 30-min sessions before I drove on the them. plus a 30-miles trip to the track. > IMNSHO, of course :-) Of course. I don't think anyone expects different of you. :) > IMNSHO, this is a waste of money for an HPDE application. > > If you're doing some kind of competitive event (time trial, race, etc), > then yeah, a shave on the RA-1s will be beneficial. If you're "just" doing > HPDEs, put the shaving money toward more seat time - or more beer at event > dinners, whichever :-) Well, it has been many people's experiences that they provide more ultimate grip longer shaved than not. If you don't have the time to properly break-in the tire and want to go balls out on the tire right away, I definitely think shaving is the way to go. If I was using them double-duty (street and track), I'd buy them full tread and hope I put enough miles on them until my first on-track experience. Just my $.02. Drive Safely, Raza
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#3. Re: [E36M3] fixed rear seat removal - from jeff.conner@yahoo.com
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 12:48:40 -0700 (PDT) From: jeff.conner@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [E36M3] fixed rear seat removal > Jim Bassett - yes, I'll get the updated "Race Car" stuff up > there *soon*, I promise :-) Suuuuuuuuure you will, Jim.... but which letter of the alphabet will the car own? ;-) -jeff ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with Yahoo! FareChase. http://farechase.yahoo.com/
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#4. Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events - from Mark Dadgar
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 13:05:42 -0700 From: Mark Dadgar <mark@pdc-racing.net> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events On Jun 5, 2007, at 12:35 PM, Raza Uddin wrote: >> No disrespect, but that's a *driver* issue, not a tire issue. Going >> full-steam on full-tread tires initially is just plain silly. > > Possibly, but no one ever made me aware of the fact that the tread > might > squirm that much. Once I expected the squirm, yes, I adjusted my > driving. Generally, when you change something on the car, you go out easy to figure out how the behavior has changed. Heck, your outlap should *always* be easy. The track and the car both change minute by minute. You never know what has ruptured, weakened, bent, etc while the car was sitting in the paddock between runs. This won't always save you (witness my crash at Buttonwillow last Friday), but it's good practice to get into. - Mark ----- mark@pdc-racing.net Check out my JustRacing homepage at: http://www.justracing.com/homepage/mdadgar
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#5. Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events - from Jim Bassett
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 13:11:16 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jim Bassett" <jim@jimbassett.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] Toyo RA1s for DE Events On Tue, June 5, 2007 12:35 pm, Raza Uddin wrote: > But, these are r-compound tires designed for racing and not some 10/32nds > street tires, not even the Falken RT-615s I recently drove on at full > tread > did that. I guess maybe I expected more from them initially. Well, the RA-1s are a softer compound that any street tire, so I would expect them to squirm more, just 'cause the tread blocks are softer and will wiggle more. > I think the amount of squirm you get is very much dependent on the car. A > light, well-setup, suspensioned E36 is going to perform a helluva a lot > better on the full tread RA-1s than a full-fat, stock suspension and > wheeled 300zx Twin Turbo (which I was driving at the time). Oh, well then... :-) (Sorry, I didn't catch that this was referring to a non-E36 car.) And actually, again from my experience, the opposite is true. Granted, it's been nearly 6 years since I tracked the M3, but I don't recall noticing as much squirm with it as I have with the race car. The M3 only had sway bars & front hats swapped, so there was a lot of softness still in the suspension/chassis which probably masked the squirm. On the other hand, the race car is stiff & solid, and thus transmits more "tire feel" to the driver - which is the idea, after all. So I would expect to feel the squirm more on a race car. > They squirmed throughout the session. It wasn't just a one-lap deal. Right. I mentioned using the whole session as a practice session, not just one lap. > Of course. I don't think anyone expects different of you. :) Oh great, I've become predictable :-) > Well, it has been many people's experiences that they provide more > ultimate > grip longer shaved than not. I don't think I necessarily disputed that. However, the full-tread drop-off is not that dramatic, and for an HPDE environment would be nearly unnoticeable. I'm not saying "Don't shave 'em ever". Just look at the situation (when I ran a few races on RA-1s, I did have a separate, shaved set for that purpose). > If you don't have the time to properly > break-in the tire Make time. It'll save you money, and give you better performance, regardless of tire/shaved/etc. And, frankly, this is about more than just "tires", now. An advanced-level driver, IMO, should start to think about things like preparation (car and driver), car set-up, getting to notice and deal with small changes in the car/track/driver from one lap to another, nevermind session-to-session and event-to-event. > and want to go balls out on the tire right away, Come on, do I really have to comment on this? :-) > I'd buy them full tread and hope I put enough miles on > them until my first on-track experience. I try not to "hope" for things when it comes to track situations. I'd rather "prepare" and "know" what I'm dealing with - even if it's full-tread, brand-spanking-new tires. Not meaning to pick on you, Raza, but I know you have a fair amount of track experience. There's more to it that just driving, at a certain point. Jim Bassett
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#6. turner fixed camber plates - from Robert Manger
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 15:59:21 -0400 From: "Robert Manger" <Robert_Manger@Mastercard.com> Subject: turner fixed camber plates Hi all, anyone have any experience with the fixed camber plates that Turner offers? I know they reuse the factory rubber parts, but besides that this could be an easy way to have a constant fixed camber, I would bet the majority of adj camber plate users set it and forget it. rob CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message and any attachments are only for the use of the intended recipient and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, distribution or other use of this e-mail message or attachments is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail message in error, please delete and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
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#7. RE: [E36M3] Bridgestone RE-01R's - from Sinha, Vikas
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 16:19:05 -0400 From: "Sinha, Vikas" <Vikas.Sinha@aam.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] Bridgestone RE-01R's > Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 14:59:54 -0400 > From: Mark Duckworth <mdlkml@atari-source.com> > >> Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 12:19:05 -0400 >> From: "Alex Demsky" <hyper_m3@hotmail.com> >> >> Can I ask what tire pressure you guys found to be the best? I havent >> liked these tires since theyve been on my car. I cant feel anything on >> the road the front end feels numb. >> > > I prefer around 38lbs but since they just got put on > I didn't adjust them so they're probably right at 36-37lbs. I run mine at 39 psi on the street, will probably start with Kirk's recommendation for the track. Vik 97 M3/4
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#8. RE: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates - from Weston-Lewis, Graeme
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 14:23:08 -0600 From: "Weston-Lewis, Graeme" <Graeme.Weston-Lewis@lsi.com> Subject: RE: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates Simpler (and cheaper) way is to simple swap the stock strut hats left to right. If you are going to pay good money, spend the extra and buy adjustable units. IMHO, Graeme -----Original Message----- From: Robert Manger [mailto:Robert_Manger@Mastercard.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 2:15 PM To: E36M3 Subject: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 15:59:21 -0400 From: "Robert Manger" <Robert_Manger@Mastercard.com> Subject: turner fixed camber plates Hi all, anyone have any experience with the fixed camber plates that Turner offers? I know they reuse the factory rubber parts, but besides that this could be an easy way to have a constant fixed camber, I would bet the majority of adj camber plate users set it and forget it. rob CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE This e-mail message and any attachments are only for the use of the intended recipient and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, distribution or other use of this e-mail message or attachments is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail message in error, please delete and notify the sender immediately. Thank you. ************************************************* Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com DIGEST INFORMATION: http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm *************************************************
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#9. Re: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates - from Gus Iverson
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 13:27:48 -0700 From: "Gus Iverson" <gus.iverson@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates Actually, I'm a big fan of adjustables. You'll have fixed rear camber, true (unless someone has a solution I'm unaware of) but you can save the life of your fronts on the street, which is at least a useful advantage. RA-1s and similar require a lot more negative camber in front than I'd like to run on the street, personally. Changing the alignment with my TCK plates is a simple job. When the car is up to put the wheels on I slide the adjustment over. Same when taking it apart. It's a good way to remember to change the settings on the front damper at the same time. Other than cost (though I haven't spec'd cost recently) I see no reason to avoid adjustables. On 6/5/07, Robert Manger <Robert_Manger@mastercard.com> wrote: > Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 15:59:21 -0400 > From: "Robert Manger" <Robert_Manger@Mastercard.com> > Subject: turner fixed camber plates > > Hi all, > > anyone have any experience with the fixed camber plates that Turner > offers? I know they reuse the factory rubber parts, but besides that this > could be an easy way to have a constant fixed camber, I would bet the > majority of adj camber plate users set it and forget it. > > rob > > > CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE > This e-mail message and any attachments are only for the use of the intended recipient and may contain information that is privileged, confidential or exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, distribution or other use of this e-mail message or attachments is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail message in error, please delete and notify the sender immediately. Thank you. > > ************************************************* > Please help support the E36M3 list by visiting our sponsors: > > Bimmerworld http://www.bimmerworld.com > Turner Motorsport http://www.turnermotorsport.com > Eurosport High Performance http://www.eurosporthighperformance.com > Rogue Engineering http://www.rogueengineering.com > Treehouse Racing http://www.treehouseracing.com > Elephant Motorsports Inc. http://www.elephantmotorsports.com > > DIGEST INFORMATION: > http://www.bmw-m.net/resources/digest_info.htm > ************************************************* > > >
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#10. Re: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates - from Jim Bassett
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Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 13:43:06 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jim Bassett" <jim@jimbassett.com> Subject: Re: [E36M3] turner fixed camber plates On Tue, June 5, 2007 1:35 pm, Gus Iverson wrote: > You'll have fixed rear camber, > true (unless someone has a solution I'm unaware of) Rear camber is adjustable from the factory :-) > RA-1s and similar require a lot more negative camber in front than I'd > like to run on the street, personally. In terms of camber, I had the hats swapped on the M3, which got me about -2.5 up front. With judicious tire rotation, I didn't have too much of a wear issue. Swapped hats was, in my case, a simple, easy (free! :-)) compromise setting for a car that was both my track car and daily driver. YTWMV :-) The race car currently runs at about -3.5 up front (-3 at the rear). Jim Bassett